ideas for building a dragon killing druid (needed for backstory)

[Joker[ZW]]

So the everyone always and instantly knows, that the barking dog is casting a spell? IMO identifying spoken words as a spell being cast is includet in the identify Spell function of Spellcraft.

15 + spell level Identify a spell being cast. (You must see or hear the spell’s verbal or somatic components.) No action required. No retry.

I think failing that check would make the Dragon unable to discern if the Caster really casts a Spell or is just saying something.

I made the distance 50ft because of baleful polymorph. I think you are correct about lightning storm.

 

[Sejs]

Granted, the dragon would have a much easier time hearing the druid than seeing him once he's begun to cast his spell. One could argue that there's a difference between a normal creature that can speak chanting a spell versus say a bullfrog croaking out a spell, but then that would be getting into house rules so I'll just drop it.


However, again we get to the point of the hollow victory for the dragon. Yippe! He can hear the druid once he's begun to cast his spell! Bravo. And even though he's heard the spell and may be able to identify what spell is being cast, there's nothing the dragon can do to stop the spell from completing.


I fail to see why you're pushing so hard on this point. It's irrelevant.

 

[Darklone]

That Spellcraft check is for correctly identifying a spell you want to counterspell (e.g. you need to know which spell it is).

If spellcasting is not obvious, it would be pretty hard to disrupt spellcasting... The player could simply say something (perhaps even as ME action), get smacked, then cast his spell, right? Don't you allow fighters without spellcraft skills to recognise whether someone casts a spell or simply babbles?

Don't find it right now or perhaps it's not anymore in the core books, in the 3.0 books there was some sentence that made it pretty clear that even casting a spell without any components it's still obvious that the guy is casting a spell. Wasn't there some FAQ on this?

 

[Sejs]

Sort of. A still, silent, eschewed spell still provokes an AoO - the spellcaster is still visibly concentrating hard on making his spell manifest. More importantly, unless he opts to cast on the defensive, he's distracted to the point of letting his guard down. However, to the fighter taking the AoO on the wizard casting a S/S/E spell there's no way to tell if the wizard is casting a spell, or just has really bad gas pains. All the fighter knows is hey, there's an opening, I should take advantage of it.

As for spellcraft, there is no way to identify an S/S/E spell as it's being cast because it's impossible to meet the criteria "must be able to see or hear the somatic or verbal components of the spell". There's nothing to see or hear, so you can't see or hear it. You can, however, guess that the guy whose face is screwed up in concentration is probably doing something that you'd rather he didn't.

 

[Joker[ZW]]

I think my interpretation is more in line with the rules as written. Otherwise there would have to be some Invisible voice telling everyone when there is a spell being cast as to differentiate it from random babbling. Even an Int3 Half Orc barbarian who has never seen a spell being cast in his life would be able to instantly identify the words someone utters as a spell being cast.
You don't even have to believe that Magic exists and see any effects of the spell to identify it as one.

 

[Derren]

Your interpretation would make sense, but rules wise, the other assumption is correct that a Int 3 orc who doesn't believe in magic would recognize a spell beeing cast in an unkown language.

Not that I support that few, but that is a gray area for simpler gaming so you don't have to check every time if the archer speaks the same laguage/alphabet of the wizard when he readies an action to interrupt spellcasting.

 

[Darklone]

Well, for me it was always like this: Someone starts to cast a spell, e.g. some light effects, funny sounds and other minor effects take place. Shimmering air, voice sounds strange. That's not supported by the rules as well (only psionics), but minor effects are nice and fit the game.

After all, the magic motor has to be started

 

[Joker[ZW]]

Your interpretation would make sense, but rules wise, the other assumption is correct that a Int 3 orc who doesn't believe in magic would recognize a spell beeing cast in an unkown language.

"Identify a spell being cast" sounds more like my interpretation IMO. I actually don't see yours supported by the rules.
Your interpretation would mean, that an invisible, mind blanked mage could cast a Silent, still spell like detect evil around lvl1 orc barbarians and everyone in an unspecified range would instantly know that someone they don't see is casting a spell, though they have no chance of identifying which as they don't hear/see the spell being cast.

 

[Darklone]

By the rules, they would, no matter how funny that may seem. It would be hard to ready an attack to interrupt that guy, but someone with Scent or other means of attacking invisible creatures (True Strike for example) would be able to do that. That sentence about "identifying a spell being cast" is used in the context clearly about knowing exactly which spell is being cast.

 

[Joker[ZW]]

I can only repeat myself, I don't see your view supported by the rules

That sentence about "identifying a spell being cast" is used in the context clearly about knowing exactly which spell is being cast.

That's what I don't agree with.