IF a PDFs of the 3 core books were leaked, would you:

[Lonely Tylenol]

Hm, it'd certainly be possible (heck, probable) harm for the company if their books were leaked ahead of time, so I'd say it'd be morally questionable to download them... but practically speaking, unless the entire internet refused to look at the books, the cat's already out of the bag, and all the harm's already been done.

Since it's a victimless crime that doesn't harm society (because, well, you're not harming WotC's sales beyond what already legal methods allow you to do, you're just doing it at home), I don't see a moral fault in downloading books post-release for preview purposes only. Of course, it should still be illegal, because unlike a preview reading in a bookstore, it has very easy and obvious possibilities for misuse.

Yeah, pretty much. Too many people confuse "illegal" and "immoral". There are acts that we prohibit by law because it would be morally wrong for people to perform them. Then there are acts that we prohibit by law because to allow them would result in undesirable outcomes. Breaking the law is not always immoral, it's just always illegal.

 

[Vegepygmy]

Frankly, the only chance that I will buy 4e at all is if I download pirated PDFs (or take the time to read hard copies in a book store or something, which is unlikely) and discover to my surprise that all of my fears were mistaken, in which case I would definitely go buy legitimate hard copies.

Put me down for the (unavailable option): download, read, probably NOT play, but pay if I do.

 

[Crashy75]

Yeah, pretty much. Too many people confuse "illegal" and "immoral". There are acts that we prohibit by law because it would be morally wrong for people to perform them. Then there are acts that we prohibit by law because to allow them would result in undesirable outcomes. Breaking the law is not always immoral, it's just always illegal.

QFT

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

I wouldn't be interested in the pdfs- First, I generally dislike e-publication of any kind as a format, and second, unless it was a semi-official leak for some purpose, I'd avoid them for legal and ethical reasons.

 

[AZRogue]

I really don't see how this is any different from sitting down at Barnes & Nobles to read through a rule book before you walk up to the register. I don't know any bookstore in the world that keeps their books behind lock and key and demands payment before you can even flip through a couple pages.

I also don't see the difference between "downloading it, reading it, deciding its crap, and deleting it" and putting something back on the shelf. It's really the same exact transaction except that one's at home and the other's at the store.

I mean, as long as WotC gets paid their $$, who cares what the exact order of actions are? It's not like my reading a PDF prevents other would-be-customers from paying their money. I know what the law is, but I've just never see any moral harm here.

I voted the third choice because I pay authors whose work I like and because printed books are better than PDFs. (though both is even better)

I consider it "shifty" because, with a .pdf, I own the material. I can print pages, make copies, do whatever I want. It's not really the same as browsing Barnes and Noble unless they let you photocopy sections of the book, set up a table to run a game for a while, and let you stay reading the book for a few weeks.

But, even though I think it's shifty, I would hardly let that stand in my way.

I'm a firm believer in living a moral life, as long as it doesn't interfere with me getting what I want through any means necessary. Every moral compass should come with a lid and attractive carrying case for when you put it away.

 

[WhatGravitas]

To be completely honest, I am planning on eventually finding some way to get a computerized copy of 4e. While I agree that a soft copy is no substitute for a hard copy, the opposite is also true. I can't sit down in a comfy chair and read through a pdf, but I also can't search for keywords in hardback book, nor can I carry the book around to reference while I'm on break at work. The lack of a text version of the SRD published by WotC means that I'll have to find another way to get a soft copy if I want one.

The key to being legal here, of course, is that I must own the hard copies first before it's legal to have the soft copy.

That's the reason why I want a pdf-copy of owned books for a nominal fee of about $1 - $2. Because a soft copy is incredibly useful as DM (or the SRD). If they fail to provide that, they fail at "making DMing easier".

Cheers, LT.

 

[LowSpine]

Download, still buy.

Having a pdf is not the same as having a hard copy of a book.

1. Books don't make your eyes bleed.
2. pdfs are supposed to be portable - if you consider a PC portable. Even if you have a laptop you either have to have it plugged in or read really quickly before your battery runs out.
3. If you have the money to buy it, and it is good enough to buy, then you will buy it. If it is rubbish or you have not enough money you will not buy it.
4. There is something magical about books. The texture of the print and the paper. (Or maybe I'm just getting high from the print fumes.)

I may be wrong but in law I think you are allowed to have a copy of a product for personal use as long as you have bought and own the product - so as long as you own it downloading a pdf version is not illegal. This may be a myth or they might have changed the law, but I have heard verdicts to this effect.

No-one wants a line they love to be damaged by copyright theft.

It is in most human nature that people want to own a hard piece of belonging. Old game CDs used to come in huge boxes because the big boxes used to justify the high price of the product and gave people a feeling of ownership with that stupidly big box sitting on their shelf.

Most film buffs and music lovers are not satisfied with shoddy mp3 quality, badly printed covers and recordible disks with permanent marker scrawled all over it.

 

[LowSpine]

That's the reason why I want a pdf-copy of owned books for a nominal fee of about $1 - $2. Because a soft copy is incredibly useful as DM (or the SRD). If they fail to provide that, they fail at "making DMing easier".

Cheers, LT.

The one thing I like about pdfs that a hard copy doesn't have is the ability to copy and paste relevent information over to a new document without having to type for hours.

If you have an encounter you can paste all the tricky info you need for that encounter into an encounter page.

 

[LowSpine]

I consider it "shifty" because, with a .pdf, I own the material. I can print pages, make copies, do whatever I want. It's not really the same as browsing Barnes and Noble unless they let you photocopy sections of the book, set up a table to run a game for a while, and let you stay reading the book for a few weeks.

But, even though I think it's shifty, I would hardly let that stand in my way.

I'm a firm believer in living a moral life, as long as it doesn't interfere with me getting what I want through any means necessary. Every moral compass should come with a lid and attractive carrying case for when you put it away.

Printing a 300 page pdf would cost a damn site more than buying the book in ink and paper. Plus the hardcopy would be rubbish, not to mention the time and annoyance.

 

[DanChops]

I voted for "download, still buy". I have the three-book set on preorder from Amazon, and there's no way I would cancel that order. (Assuming I could download the .pdf without exposing myself to a plethora of viruses.)

Quite frankly, while I agree that downloading would be illegal (assuming you're living in the U.S. or someother jurisdiction where said action is illegal) I can't fathom how it could possibly be immoral, or even unethical. The only time I could consider pirating IP to be immoral would be when you use the priated copy in lieu of purchasing a bona fide copy of the work. However, since the books aren't even available for purchase yet, how can anything be done in lieu of purchasing them at this point? Of course, if one were to download a pirated .pdf and then not purchase the books when they were available while still utilizing the .pdf in lieu of the books, then that would be immoral. But as a preview? before the books are avialable? intending fully to purchase them when they become available? How does that even approach questionable morality?