Immortal's Handbook continuation thread

[Upper_Krust]

Hi Anubis mate!

For more, I think Impeesa put it betterthan I ever could have by comparing the cost to the other various bonus types. Like he said, although I still think it's impossible, for the very reason he gave why you shouldn't in the first place, equating the other stuff is useless if you lose the equity within that grouping.

Actually I just replied to that particular argument.

BTW, UK, you may wanna interject on the force weapon enhancement discussion. I may disagree with your CR and magic CURRENT magic item stuff, but for new stuff, you seem to have a good enough grasp of things.

Sure no problem mate. I already saw you asking me to respond in the thread itself, but I have been kept busy in here, limiting my posting elsewhere.

By the way, with the +1250 weapon that makes an entire race die if one is touched,

Actually a lot of the market bonuses I previously discussed should be halved. The above should only be +625.

does that mean if you kill one deity that they all die? Or is it if you kill a creature that is the same race as a deity, that deity dies?

The second one.

You actually get a saving throw of course, but you won't make it, trust me.

 

[Clay_More]

Excuse me for being bewildering when I inquired about the undead deities.
Will they be like the Atropal? (gods born living, yet slain and brought back to life) or will they be created undead? I have always seen gods a "energy" filled creatures that might have problems regarding undeath. I figured thats why even the God of the Undead (Orcus) wasn't undead himself.

I read the Force weapon thread actually, I noticed Anubis remark there as well, figured it might be something you would be up for.... The call a +15 bonus "much"..... tsk tsk

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hi Eldorian mate!

How can you have a balance issue, while playtesting, with a low costing, passive effect magic item? I don't advocate increasing the price HUGELY, like UK might.

I may have went overboard initially. As I subsequently commented, the item should in no way ever be worth more than x3 its current price.

As for the amulet being as expensive as the ring of deflection, although the item creation rules don't mention, did you ever wonder why Forge Ring gets a feat all by itself?

To limit players ambitions I wouldn't wonder.

Perhaps because rings are meant to be more powerful than wonderous items.

Irrelevant. The deflection bonus is standardised at Bonus squared x 2000 GP.

What we are debating here is the value of natural armour versus deflection. Obviously deflection is superior.

Therefore a Ring of Deflection should cost more than an Amulet of Natural Armour with the same bonus.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hello again mate!

Excuse me for being bewildering when I inquired about the undead deities.

No harm done!

Will they be like the Atropal? (gods born living, yet slain and brought back to life) or will they be created undead?

Either/or.

I have always seen gods a "energy" filled creatures that might have problems regarding undeath.

Divinity can attach itself to anything as well as anyone.

I figured thats why even the God of the Undead (Orcus) wasn't undead himself.

You don't have to be undead to have the Undeath template. Just as not all Necromancers are undead.

I read the Force weapon thread actually, I noticed Anubis remark there as well, figured it might be something you would be up for.... The call a +15 bonus "much"..... tsk tsk

I had another look in, its all a bit confusing though.

 

[Anubis]

Logically about Bonus squared x 400 sounds about right. Which means that placing the Great Fortitude feat into a magic item would cost 1600 GP. Which is far off where our perceived average feat cost (4000 GP) is. Ideally we would want the Great Fortitude feat to be at least +3 (3600 GP) to bring it into line. Of course this is only a minor change, but poignant when the potential for deities to scale such abilities wildly is available: think Divine Fortitude.

Vice versa, if we assume that the Great Fortitude feat is spot on at +2, then a single feat change should cost bonus squared x 1000 (4000 GP item). The idea then would be to reset the modifier for the resistance bonus. Probably bonus squared x 3000 (Giving us a 75,000 GP +5 Cloak of Resistance)

So ideally, either:

Great Fortitude Feat = +2 Bonus
Cloak of Resistance = Bonus squared x 3000

OR

Great Fortitude Feat = +3 Bonus
Cloak of Resistance = Bonus squared x 1000

Actually, I have house-ruled the standard save bonus feats (Great Fortitude, Lightning Reflexes, Iron Will) to give +4, and have added a new feat that gives +1 to all saves. (The reason is the same as the reasoning behind +5 for Skill Focus with +2 to two skills for other feats.)

Where does that put everything?

Actually something I have noticed is that Luck (and Insight while we are on the subject) are very badly handled.

Case in point. Luck is valued at bonus squared x 2500. But technically that is for attacks; damage; armour class; saves and checks.

No it's not. The Luck Bonus costs are for a single modifier. For Luck Bonus to attack +2, it costs 2^2*2500, and so on and so forth. To add a Luck Bonus to multiple things, you must double the costs as per the DMG. It's all right there in both the DMG and T&B.

 

[Clay_More]

Im especially interested in the Undead deities part, my current campaign is life vs. death oriented (which is why I had to make a Vampire & Lich Template). Also, any weapon qualities which are of definite "Undead" character (as opposed to merely evil)?

One thing I was wondering, now that you seem to be getting so deeply involved in both deities and weapon qualities (something I was thinking myself at times). Have you made any way in which weapon qualities can be "tied" to certain gods?
(I.e. that the clerics of certain gods, for example, might have benefits for creating certain weapon qualities or even have unique qualities for their gods?).

Anyways, I dont know I should re-post the last questions in the Vampire thread here as well......

 

[Anubis]

I figured thats why even the God of the Undead (Orcus) wasn't undead himself.

Orcus is not the God of the Undead, he's the DEMON PRINCE of Undead. Nerull and Wee Jas are the Gods of the Undead. (Hades in Olympic Pantheon, Anubis/Nephthys in the Pharaonic Pantheon, Hel in the Asgardian Pantheon)

 

[Clay_More]

Sorry, my mistake Anubis (how could I even forget your name's relation to Egyptian Mythology). I wasn't taking into consideration the many works done on earth mythologies for 2 Ed.
Im just getting too packed up in my current campaign, I use Orcus as the "opposition" signifying undeath.

Anubis, would you know the god of death in the Hinduistic Pantheon? I know that Shiva represents Destruction, but I am not exactly sure if she represents actual death. If my memory serves me right, I think it is Kali, but im not sure... Think its Kali... though.....

 

[Dark Wolf 97]

Its my birthday!!!

Just been itching to get that out.

Originally posted by Clay_More
Will they be like the Atropal?(gods born living, yet slain and brought back to life) or will they be created undead?

And Clay_More, I though Atropals were stillborn gods, which would make them dead at birth.

 

[Clay_More]

I dont know what I was thinking with that paragraph.....

They Werent Born Alive
They Werent Slain (The were already dead)
They Werent Brought Back to Life (Undeads are NEVER brought back to life... more likely to unlife)...

Im a confused, demented old man. I will go pour hot coffee in my lap...

EDIT: SORRY!... almost forgot, congrats!