instead of Bard spells, Ritual songs?

[cr0m]

I've been playing a Bard for about six months now in a friend's Freeport campaign and to my surprise, enjoying the heck out of it. But one thing has always bothered me about the Bard. The archetype generally is of a performer so talented that his songs enchant or otherwise bamboozle his enemies, but the Bard's songs aren't anything like that, with the exception of Fascinate. Instead he has spells, but the spells have nothing to do with music or performance.

It seems to me that Rituals might be a good fit for Bard powers. They take a while, they require elaborate maneuvers (ie singing, strumming, etc) and props (instruments) and they achieve something magical, but rarely instantaneous (putting the giants' stronghold to sleep so it can be robbed, dazzling the sorceress so she falls in love with the Bard instead of killing him, etc).

Whatcha think?

 

[Fallen Seraph]

I could see something similar to this, but more as a Class ability.

If you could indulge me, I imagine something like this:

A Bard has a series of Class Ability bonuses that increase in level (similar to Rogue's Sneak Attack) that can be added onto Perform Rituals to give extra affects/more chance of success.

This would let the idea of performance become something more special for the Bard. But by keeping them as simply bonuses to specific Perform Rituals, it keeps the Bard open to have Powers that aren't as directly linked to Perform Rituals (given that Rituals cannot be used in combat).

 

[mach1.9pants]

I am afraid, F.S., I am not on your wave length with rituals doing long term skills (on the other thread). I see where you are coming from, but I reckon rituals are just going to be magical type effects.
But on the original question there are no reason for bards to use rituals for their music. They should just be powers with the implement descriptor (bonus' when using a harp etc) and if they are described as songs with a sustain action you are there. 4E power system could cover bardic music much better than previous editions.

 

[Fallen Seraph]

I wonder what with Powers and all, if we could have different Powers we could choose from to represent different art-forms?

 

[osmanb]

I'd also point out that while your statement was true in the PHB, all of the 3.5 splat-books have been addressing that somewhat. There are quite a few spells added to the Bard list now that augment or interact with their Bardic Music ability. It's definitely still something of a disconnect, but if you really want to (and your DM allows it), you can make a Bard that is heavily focused on using their Bardic Music. At high levels, you can also pursue some of the very cool prestige classes that take those abilities even further ... I forget the name, but there's one that basically gets a new Bardic Music ability (including damage songs) every level.

 

[frankthedm]

I've been playing a Bard for about six months now in a friend's Freeport campaign and to my surprise, enjoying the heck out of it. But one thing has always bothered me about the Bard. The archetype generally is of a performer so talented that his songs enchant or otherwise bamboozle his enemies, but the Bard's songs aren't anything like that, with the exception of Fascinate. Instead he has spells, but the spells have nothing to do with music or performance.

It seems to me that Rituals might be a good fit for Bard powers. They take a while, they require elaborate maneuvers (ie singing, strumming, etc) and props (instruments) and they achieve something magical, but rarely instantaneous (putting the giants' stronghold to sleep so it can be robbed, dazzling the sorceress so she falls in love with the Bard instead of killing him, etc).

Whatcha think?

Completely agree. This is exactly what I expect from a bard. The few scant seconds verbal components last for is nowhere near long enough for 'The magic of song.'

 

[Nifft]

If I understand them correctly, "Ritual" strongly implies out-of-combat use.

IMHO, Bards should be able to use their abilities in combat.

Cheers, -- N

 

[Irda Ranger]

If I understand them correctly, "Ritual" strongly implies out-of-combat use.

IMHO, Bards should be able to use their abilities in combat.

That's not what the OP is saying. Of course the Bard will have in-combat abilities. The OP's point was that the Bard should have Rituals (just like the Wizard and Cleric do), but that the Bard's rituals should be powered through song/performance. I think it's a great idea.

In combat I think the Bard would move like a Rogue and buff (with this inspiring words) like a Warlord. If he wanted to heal someone outside of combat though he would sing the Dirge of Mishakel (or whomever is the deity of healing in your world), a Bardic Ritual of Healing.

This is giving me a lot of cool ideas. The Bard could be so many things:
1. Martial Leader with access to Bardic Rituals (very Viking Skald/Iron Heroes).
2. Bardic (new power source) Leader with access to Bardic Rituals.
3. Arcane Leader with access to Bardic Rituals (but not Arcane Rituals).

etc.

 

[frankthedm]

If I understand them correctly, "Ritual" strongly implies out-of-combat use.

IMHO, Bards should be able to use their abilities in combat.

IMHO they are not a class that should be focusing on combat. The Bard should be out of his element with a tactical strike team.

 

[SSquirrel]

You may want to look at the Complete Book of Eldritch Might. Monte created a variant bard that is all about songs.