Invisible combat?

[Legildur]

Can anyone point me to a good reference or explanation of conducting combat when one of the opponents is invisible?

My current PbEM game is facing an invisible devil with reach (natural and whip), spell-like abilities, etc.

Neither my DM nor the players are really sure how to handle AOOs, determining which square to strike, etc.

Help!!!

 

[kreynolds]

Check out the PH and the DMG for information about using Spot and Listen checks to notice/pinpoint an invisible creature. When you pick a square to attack, you do just that...you pick one and hope it's the right square. Even if it is, you still suffer the miss chance. Also, if you are attacked by an invisible creature, you automatically know what direction the attack came from.

That help any?

 

[Hypersmurf]

Isn't there a Sage Advice or FAQ entry somewhere that says invisible opponents still provoke AoOs, even if it seems really odd?

Like if the aforementioned devil were to sheathe a dagger, or drink a potion, in a threatened square, the threatening character could make an AoO (despite the fact that he has no idea what the devil is doing to provoke one)... though he still needs to pick a square and suffers the miss chance.

-Hyp.

 

[hong]

Isn't there a Sage Advice or FAQ entry somewhere that says invisible opponents still provoke AoOs, even if it seems really odd?

Like if the aforementioned devil were to sheathe a dagger, or drink a potion, in a threatened square, the threatening character could make an AoO (despite the fact that he has no idea what the devil is doing to provoke one)... though he still needs to pick a square and suffers the miss chance.

The rationale for the AoO is that the character who takes the provoking action is momentarily distracted from the combat. They have to fumble around for their potion, or concentrate on their spell, or aim their crossbow, or whatever. The person who _takes_ the AoO thus has a better chance to hit. This remains true whether or not the provoking character is visible, so long as the attacker is aware of their presence and actively trying to hit them.

 

[candidus_cogitens]

A couple of strategies:

1) Readied attacks. Wait for him to attack you first. That way, you know where he is, and you get to attack immediately before he has a chance to move away again.

2) Animals with scent. If you don't have an animal companion or familiar that has scent, use a summoning spell. If the animal can find it, then it gives you a good clue where the thing is.

3) Grapple. That way you don't have to worry about accidentally attacking an ally as you both move around in the dark. Once you successfully grapple the enemy, then you can holler to your friends and gang up on him.

 

[Kyramus]

blind fighting feat!!!!!

but in most cases, if he has a reach, and it's an invisible devil/demon with a brain, it'll attack just outside of reach once a round and keep moving. IT wouldn't care to do full round as long as he's doling out damage and causing confusion.

Add it to an already existing fight and you get chaos.

 

[Caliban]

According to the DMG (Page 78 I believe):

Table: Listen Check DCs to Detect Invisible Creatures

Invisible Creature Is: DC
---------------------- --
In combat or speaking 0
Moving at half speed Move Silently check
Moving at full speed Move Silently check at –4
Running or charging Move Silently check at –20
Some distance away +1 per 10 feet
Behind an obstacle (door) +5
Behind an obstacle (stone wall) +15


This is just to detect that someone is near you, not to pinpoint them.

If you beat their Move Silent roll by 20, you pinpoint their square.

Spot Check DC to notice the presence of an invisible person is DC 20.

The Scent ability allows you to pinpoint an invisible creature if you are within 5' of them, negating the miss chance.

Blindsight negates the effects of invisibility within the radius of the blindsight.

 

[kreynolds]

Spot Check DC to notice the presence of an invisible person is DC 20.

If you beat the DC by 20, you also pinpoint them. But damn, that's hard!

 

[TabulaRasa]

The Scent ability allows you to pinpoint an invisible creature if you are within 5' of them, negating the miss chance.

The miss chance is still 50% the scent ability doesn’t remove that.
The scenting creature just know the right square to attack.

/Tabula

 

[shilsen]

If you beat the DC by 20, you also pinpoint them. But damn, that's hard!

True. That's why Listen is always a better option for pinpointing invisible attackers than Spot. As Caliban pointed out, a DC 20 Listen check will pinpoint an invisible creature in melee or speaking (or spellcasting). A 6th lvl rogue with no Wis bonus and maxed out Listen will succeed 50% of the time. And every character has a chance of making a 20 on a Listen check, as opposed to 40 for Spot.