Invisible Scrolls

[Mapleaxe]

Can an invisible wizard use his scrolls?

 

[JacktheRabbit]

By the rules the wizard and his gear is not invisible to himself. I personally hate this rule since it allows for the uber-cheese invisible flying fireballing wizard.

 

[Dash Dannigan]

By the rules the wizard and his gear is not invisible to himself. I personally hate this rule since it allows for the uber-cheese invisible flying fireballing wizard.

Reviewed the Invisibility spell, doesn't say anywhere that the invisible wizard can see himself and his gear. Where might this rule be found?

 

[Master Psion]

There was a thread on here recently about that same question. It's your DM's call. Someone made the suggestion that the wizard had to drop the scroll or throw it in the air so it would reappear then he could read from it. Unless there's a ruling on this already, I'd say that the wizard would need some means to see invisible before he could cast from the scroll.

 

[Kae'Yoss]

By the rules the wizard and his gear is not invisible to himself. I personally hate this rule since it allows for the uber-cheese invisible flying fireballing wizard.

OK, let him not see himself. Then he just casts the spells from memory, or uses see invisible.

And what's cheesy about flying, invisible wizards that throw fireball spells?

 

[Ranes]

If I can repeat a point I raised on the previous thread, there's nothing in the rules on casting from a scroll that say the caster must be holding the scroll. The important thing - all other considerations aside - is that the caster can read it. So, if an invisible caster had a scroll paper-weighted or otherwise prepared so that he could see the whole of the spell being cast from it, he could use it.

 

[Master Psion]

Which is why I mentioned the idea of dropping the scroll or tossing it in the air. Granted, trying to read something as it's floating in the air might be EXTREMELY difficult... there's no rule that I've seen that says it can't be done.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Reviewed the Invisibility spell, doesn't say anywhere that the invisible wizard can see himself and his gear. Where might this rule be found?

It can't.

What you can find is a sort-of implication that perhaps the designers assumed an invisible person could see himself, but never actually wrote it down. What they wrote down was "vanishes from sight", with no conditions.

But there are a few odd phrases in some of the spells:

Invisibility: "If you cast the spell on someone else, neither you nor your allies can see the subject, unless you can normally see invisible things or you employ magic to do so."

-- Why would they need to spell that out, unless this is somehow different to when you cast the spell on yourself?

Mass Invisibility: "Individuals in the group cannot see each other."

-- Of course not - they're invisible. Unless they can see themselves, so it's a point of distinction?

On the other hand, it may be that these points are to distinguish the spells from Invisibility Sphere, where you can see yourself and the other affected people.

I personally read that "vanishes from sight" means exactly that - you're invisible, even to yourself.

But there are those little phrases that sometimes lead people to think maybe that's not how it's meant to be...

-Hyp.

 

[Philip]

Can an invisible wizard use his scrolls?

Sure he can. Release your scroll briefly so that it turns visible, get hold of it again and read it.

... Items dropped or put down by an invisible creature become visible ...

Alternately, invisibility is an Illusion(Glamer) spell. It says under illusions that these deceive the senses or minds of OTHERS (my emphasis). Additionally, under Glamer is says that the spell changes a subject's sensory qualities, but who are the subjects in the case of invisibility? I suppose anyone but yourself, unless explicitly mentioned otherwise.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Additionally, under Glamer is says that the spell changes a subject's sensory qualities, but who are the subjects in the case of invisibility? I suppose anyone but yourself, unless explicitly mentioned otherwise.

No, the subject is yourself.

The sensory quality it changes is "what you look like".

-Hyp.