D&D 5E Is 5e "Easy Mode?"

[Mistwell]

If popular is your only goal and then yeh that makes it ahem a good element.

Since you're ignoring my advice on argumentation titles I will just use them too.

Non-responsive on point's 2 and 3, so those carry across as voting issues.

 

[Garthanos]

Non-responsive on point's 2 and 3, so those carry across as voting issues.

Points three is fine and 2 is one more assertion that only popularity is important because a complaint can be valid regardless of the over-arching popularity of the product it does not invalidate the complaint.

 

[Mistwell]

Points three is fine and 2 is one more assertion that only popularity is important because a complaint can be valid regardless of the over-arching popularity of the product it does not invalidate the complaint.

If almost nobody cares about your complaint, what makes you think it's achieved "validity"? What objective standard exists for you to state it's valid if you find so few agree concerning a consumer item?

What do you hope to even achieve with this line of argumentation? We get it, 5e isn't your thing. And?

 

[Garthanos]

If almost nobody cares about your complaint, what makes you think it's achieved "validity"?

If the best argument against (whatever specific argument) amounts to its popular its popular it means either the person arguing against it has nothing really at all. Or are bad at making arguments both are possible.

 

[Garthanos]

What do you hope to even achieve with this line of argumentation? We get it, 5e isn't your thing. And?

Kind of been looking for ways to make it more my thing like it seemed intended to be adjustable or wait that was a made claim is that wishful thinking?... no not entirely it definitely does have cool elements I really cannot decide for sure on but some of other elements I find complaint worthy.

 

[Garthanos]

And to be clear (no this is not clarifying) the it's popular its popular is raised in so many many threads one could almost think even complaints they don't agree with might have something to them.

 

[GameOgre]

Just played a great game of BX. Now to get ready for my 5E game tomorrow. I love both games. When I take a break from BX for too long I start to get so sick of 5E's way of doing things. When I take a break from 5E for too long I miss it like crazy.

Both games scratch totally different itches.

 

[Krachek]

5ed have been made easy and user friendly on purpose.
When I read the last UA variant classes, I guess that they regret to don’t have made it even more easy and friendly. 5ed is clearly designed for casual players, and we see here a debate among expert players. They speak about sharp tune up race car, while having in hand a Toyota Corolla.

This edition is not made for those who analyse deeply each options, spells, feats, mechanics.
All those mechanics that are analyse deeply on a wargame point of view, have been place there to produce a creative and entertaining experience, not much more. Of course this produce a clash, until you realize what game you really got in hand.

 

[Cap'n Kobold]

Consider this, comparing the mechanics):
DM: Make a Perception check.
Player: Crap, a 7.
The floor suddenly drops below you and you fall into a pit, landing on several spikes for 11 piercing damage. Make a Constitution save.
Player: 17
DM: You feel a slight burning, probably poison, but it doesn't cause any other effects.

or

DM: The floor suddenly drops, a pit trap? Roll percentile dice.
Player: Crap, I hope I make it. 37.
DM: You tried to leap free, but the floor dropped out too quickly. Roll a d6 to see if you land on any spikes.
Player: Spikes? Ugh. OK, A 4.
DM: You manage to rotate enough to land between two of the spikes, they glisten slightly with a thick black substance.
Player: Probably poison. Whew, that was close.

The first one is quick and doesn't build any suspense. Also, failure to detect the pit always results in damage. This is the 5e mechanic in the updated ToH.

The second one is the original mechanic. It builds more suspense, especially since players know that poison is save or die. Now they know there are pit traps with poison.

Would the first example be considered differently if the character had taken a significant amount of poison damage?

As a pure example, a trap in one system has a 50% chance to kill a character. A trap in another deals 50% of their HP.
In one,either the character either knows of the existence of the threat and can start taking measures against that knowing that the ext one could kill them, or they're dead.
In the other, they know of the threat and can start taking measures, knowing that the next one will probably kill them.

There is suspense either way.

If almost nobody cares about your complaint, what makes you think it's achieved "validity"? What objective standard exists for you to state it's valid if you find so few agree concerning a consumer item?

What do you hope to even achieve with this line of argumentation? We get it, 5e isn't your thing. And?

It isn't and doesn't have to be objective. The complaint is valid for them.
It might not be an issue for most of the users of 5e, but it is for them, and likely some other users as well.

I agree that just venting about it might not achieve much, but asking for help with the their problem is perfectly logical. Whether we're thinking up houserules or suggesting DMsguild products that solve the issue, to help with a problem, we have to accept that it exists.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Sure but you don't by for example add a piece on a washing machine and watch it go thunk thunk thunk because its imbalanced the creator packages that piece with the other one that ahem flanks it so the machine whirs (slower but with more power maybe) or you might purchase them separately but the manual tells you to purchase the other to prevent that thunk thunk thunk noise or say without the other this will go thunk thunk thunk (which is ok in the game if you want the thunk thunk thunk but I find myself guessing and homebrewing something to avoid thunk thunk thunk like the designers thought I must want thunk thunk thunk - instead of a pointing to some price that balances the benefit.

OK I went insane with an clunky example

But you aren't going to yell at the washing machine designer because it doesn't dry your clothes right?

"doing the laundry" involves washing and drying. Not just the washing machine. Plus you need to buy soap, can't yell at them for how their washer and dryer are broken because they don't come with soap, have to go and get that separate.


Again, if you want to say that the tactical module provided isn't enough for your tastes and desires? That I'm perfectly fine to concede that and we can talk about ways to homebrew it to match up to what you want.

But saying the designers were lazy and did not provide any tactical module whatsoever? I'm sorry, you are wrong. It exists. The rules are there, there are more than just the rules for flanking, and you really can't argue that they don't exist. Only that you aren't satisfied with them, which is fine. No says you have to be.