D&D 5E Is Dying really hard?

[lowkey13]

*Deleted by user*

 

[Flexor the Mighty!]

Death is trivial once you hit 5th level really. Honestly the rules on damage and healing make it hard to take this game seriously at times. And wack a mole happens a lot in any serous encounter. If I keep running 5e I'll have to house rule the heck out of it. Exhaustion levels for failed death saves is a good idea. I'll probably get rid of revivify. a 3rd level raise dead spell...no thanks.

In my last session i used the falling damage rules. So they were fighting on a swinging bridge and one fell off the side 300 feet to his...unconsciousness. 20d6 is max falling damage so his result of 106 put him in death save mode. Well the cleric zipped down there, hit him with a couple HP of healing and rather than being street pizza he was up and kicking butt in seconds. Since average damage from a fall of 200' or greater is 70 points once you hit high levels if you need to get down from the top of a tower quickly just jump. 500 foot fall? Meh, I'll land it on my face and be up and fighting!

I'm sure I'll be house ruling that.

All IME, YMMV, etc.

 

[Stalker0]

Just for an comparison:

A wolf (a common predator) has
Int 3
Wis 12
Cha 6

An ooze (the common mindless attack no matter what archetype) has
Int 1
Wis 6
Cha 1

A typical golem (the other mindless attack no matter what archetype) has
Int 3
Wis 8-11
Cha 1

A swarm of insects
Int 1
Wis 7
Cha 1


And our typical Zombie has:
Int 3
Wis 6
Cha 5


So in comparison, the zombie is actually quite intelligent. You could also argue the "mindless" aspect of Golems, Oozes, and some swarms is more to do with their charisma than their int. Its not that they can't recognize danger per say, its more that without any sense of self, they don't recognize the idea that they can be...and therefore not be. Ergo they make no attempts to avoid danger. But a zombie still has a decent int and cha, so ruling they are a bit more cautious than the typical walking dead zombie I think is a valid play.

 

[devincutler]

"A DM that has a predator attack downed foes while others are active is simply trying to wantonly kill PCs."

"So, IMO, in most cases if a DM is attacking downed PCs, he is trying to be deadlier than he should be."

Just to be clear, you took my original zombie comment, and made a normative judgment using your "common sense" observations about predators (which are not exactly accurate). Which is fine! I don't mind judge-y.

But it wasn't exactly subtext, or negative space. Anyway, have fun, and all that.

Ok. I'll grant you the "wantonly" part was assuming malicious DM intent. I should have worded it as I did in the second quote of mine you presented, which simply assumes bad judgment. I agree it was not subtext. Thanks for pointing it out.

 

[lowkey13]

*Deleted by user*

 

[devincutler]

Death is trivial once you hit 5th level really. Honestly the rules on damage and healing make it hard to take this game seriously at times. And wack a mole happens a lot in any serous encounter. If I keep running 5e I'll have to house rule the heck out of it. Exhaustion levels for failed death saves is a good idea. I'll probably get rid of revivify. a 3rd level raise dead spell...no thanks.

In my last session i used the falling damage rules. So they were fighting on a swinging bridge and one fell off the side 300 feet to his...unconsciousness. 20d6 is max falling damage so his result of 106 put him in death save mode. Well the cleric zipped down there, hit him with a couple HP of healing and rather than being street pizza he was up and kicking butt in seconds. Since average damage from a fall of 200' or greater is 70 points once you hit high levels if you need to get down from the top of a tower quickly just jump. 500 foot fall? Meh, I'll land it on my face and be up and fighting!

I'm sure I'll be house ruling that.

All IME, YMMV, etc.

The falling thing has always been a problem with D&D and its hit points, in all editions. One way to make PCs less blase about falling at higher levels while not making falls insta-death is to introduce the idea of critical damage on a fall. On a roll of 20 the damage is doubled. Or maybe a 19-20. But even then, an average 15th level fighter with a 20 Con is going to have 162 hp, and since damage in D&D has no effect until you reach 0, a high level high Con PC is going to shrug off hella falling damage even if you double it.

But the problem is that 5e has tried very hard to avoid insta-death scenarios, and the only way to make a high fall realistic is to have it be an instant death scenario. Not sure how you fix this problem in D&D other than to acknowledge that high level D&D becomes a super hero game of sorts. Other systems, like Runequest, adopt a more realistic approach and have a lot more PC death.

 

[Flexor the Mighty!]

Oh without a doubt, I've long said that at higher levels the game is less Lord of the Rings and more Justice League.

I should just say a fall of more than 100' is just death unless you have some kind of ability.

 

[lowkey13]

*Deleted by user*

 

[lowkey13]

*Deleted by user*

 

[Psikerlord#]

And it's not a realistic game we are playing by any means.

no it isnt. But it's nice to try and make it so, despite the devs.