Is mounted combat just a waste of time?

[Storyteller01]

I'm using a Cavalier in an IK campaign. It's third level so I can't say much on it yet. IK isn't as prone to dungeon crawls (war jacks are as likley to be in a dungeon as a horse), so I'm looking at maintaining an advantage for some time.

That said, I'm also looking forward to upgrading the mount. The feats don't apply to when you're only on a horse. Several critters can be used as mounts, and they can gain monster levels to increase HD, saves, etc. Some as much as 10 HD before going into huge size.

The Cavalier's Handbook does a way towards providing better mounts, including one that has Fast Healing.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

That said, I'm also looking forward to upgrading the mount. The feats don't apply to when you're only on a horse. Several critters can be used as mounts, and they can gain monster levels to increase HD, saves, etc. Some as much as 10 HD before going into huge size.

Be that as it may, many players don't want weird mounts. Sure a griffon or half-fiend roc might be more powerful, but that's not what I'm looking for. Just a horse. A tough, gritty, unintelligent horse. (Or, if you want to go weird, how about a drow riding a pumped up spider? Not a 20 Hit Dice Colossal spider, though, just a regular Large or Huge monstrous spider.)

Also, the advancing rules are a joke when it comes to mounts, and indeed for many things. Their AC scores don't improve, which is a huge deal. For my Modern campaign I've adapted the "Wild Cohort" feat for things like really vicious bears, 300 pound dogs*, and "advancing" robots.

* Do they really get that big? In the totally non-FX, almost totally realistic Absolute Rage, one of the dogs was 400 pounds! Sheesh!

 

[VirgilCaine]

If you're in a plainsy type area,it really sucks being attacked by horse archers.

 

[Delta]

Do any players in any of your groups use mounted combat much? Doesn't it seem like a waste of feats and resources in the average D&D game? (or perhaps, yours isn't an average D&D game).

I don't know, you're the one riding through town casting spells at everyone.

 

[Storyteller01]

Also, the advancing rules are a joke when it comes to mounts, and indeed for many things. Their AC scores don't improve, which is a huge deal. For my Modern campaign I've adapted the "Wild Cohort" feat for things like really vicious bears, 300 pound dogs*, and "advancing" robots.

In a typical campaign, player characters don't have advancing AC either. Characters become reliant on either class abilities or, more often, equipment. It'll get pricey, but it isn't much different than buying equipmnt for a cohort.

It does bug me that damage doesn't improve without a size increase, but there are ways around that.

As for not wanting to ride anything but a horse, well... it is D&D. Lots of knights go into battle with their shiny full plate and lances, but they pale next to the 20th level paladin with max enchantments on his mithiral weapons and armor. How many fighters say 'I just want to wear steel armor. Just good ole steel armor' when offered better alloys?

Same can go for mounts. The noble look nice with their horses, but black knight riding in on a demonic ...thing blows them away.

Also, if anyone's interested, the Cavalier's Handbook has stats for buying horses of greater quality. It won't cover all levels, but it does offer some advancement to keep the horse in the game a bit longer. It also offers feats that expand the mounted combat tree. The Mounted Massacre feat seems fun (both you AND your horse get to cleave creatures). Being able to move 5' to either side of the line while charging also helps. Admittedly, the fighter would probably be better able to make use of them.

 

[pawsplay]

Mounted combat is great... for the rider. Those poor horses, though.

 

[Aus_Snow]

I use a bunch of homebrew feats for mounted combat, in combination with some of the core ones, and those from elsewhere. The most relevant stuff though, is that which toughens the steed. These feats (and a few other little changes) make the difference, I've found.

So, "yes and no" would be my answer.

 

[brehobit]

I'll do a "ME TOO" here.

Small characters use them all the time. Beware the all-halfling clawfoot riding party of _death_. We were really scary.

At low level they are also huge. A heavy warhorse is just scary from levels 1-4 and even 5-6 they are nasty.

After that, you need the cohort or something, otherwise they just die...

 

[frankthedm]

A tough, gritty, unintelligent horse. (Or, if you want to go weird, how about a drow riding a pumped up spider? Not a 20 Hit Dice Colossal spider, though, just a regular Large or Huge monstrous spider.)

Tough horse? Dire horse in the MMII and the warmount template if the base creature is not enough.

Also, the advancing rules are a joke when it comes to mounts, and indeed for many things. Their AC scores don't improve, which is a huge deal.

Nothing's AC just goes up by advancment. That is this rules system. AC does not go up without magic. Sink feats in improved natural armour & improved toughness rather than going for attack feats.

* Do they really get that big? In the totally non-FX, almost totally realistic Absolute Rage, one of the dogs was 400 pounds! Sheesh!

Whats so out there about that? If breeders wanted to make larger dogs for working tasks rather than inbreading Lupus Canis to meet 'breed standards' those puppies could get darn big. If I understand correctly, they were not trying to get Zorba this big….

300 to 400lbs sounds not much more than a 3 HD hyena with a Elite scores favoring STR and CON.


One BIG problem is that WOTC rendered Ride by attack unusable when they took away overrunning on a charge. Doing this after rendering horses 10 feet fat really started to raise questions of how do you keep moving in the line of the charge with ride by attack.

Then they go against how a charge is supposed to operate in one explanation and then not continually provide the same answer afterwards. But maybe I just dislike the idea of a charge path not be determined by a straight line measured from the center of the attacker’s and defender’s base .

I’m none too keen on how much stuff negates charging either. It was like they realized how bad charging could get with power attack and they tried to balance it by reducing how often one could charge, rather than try and fix the inherent issues of multiplying such potentially obscene damage.

When it was “You are in the back square of the mount” in 3.0, the Medium [heavy] Lance needed reach so the rider could attack those in front of the mount. Now in 3.5 the lance became a one handed long spear while your mount lives, that also doubles [possibly triples] your doubled power attack output if you put both hands on it. :/

 

[dog45]

Feast thine eyes on the Supermount!

Also -
- http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=550048
- http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=529040