UngeheuerLich
Legend
I didn't read the whole thread, but there is a big difference between 3.5 and 5.5...
10 years vs 3 years...
After 10 years, you can buy new books.
10 years vs 3 years...
After 10 years, you can buy new books.
D&D (2024) Is the 5E player base going to split?
- Thread starter Reynard
- Start date
Parmandur
Book-Friend, he/him
That's also why they stsrted.openly talking about this in 2021, 3 years early. Anyone who buys in the next few years has access to the information that a new revision is coming, and if they can make it worthwhile with new art and improved organization...well, people who bought relatively recently probably won't begrudge it overall.
UngeheuerLich
Legend
The exponential growth will stop anyway, because at some point saturation happens.
This is usually a reason to start a new edition, because you reset to zero and start a new exponential growth.
Thinking exponential growth of a single edition can go on forever is a terrible misunderstanding of how mathematics work.
HaroldTheHobbit
Hero
The forum dramas over details and revisions will continue as usual. With the amount of money many of us spend on rpg stuff I still guess a majority here will get the new core books, big or small revisions included, and pick what we want for our table. As usual.
What may cause a split though is the tone and style, and target audience, of WotCs published content the coming years - that has already begun. For me, most of the last years releases hasn't really gotten my juices flowing. Since I mostly home-brew I can still play D&D until I die, and I definitely see myself spending less bucks on WotC stuff the coming years.
With that said, when our current campaign wrap up sometime in the fall I will probably run WFRP 4e and the revised The Enemy Within campaign for the next couple of years.
What may cause a split though is the tone and style, and target audience, of WotCs published content the coming years - that has already begun. For me, most of the last years releases hasn't really gotten my juices flowing. Since I mostly home-brew I can still play D&D until I die, and I definitely see myself spending less bucks on WotC stuff the coming years.
With that said, when our current campaign wrap up sometime in the fall I will probably run WFRP 4e and the revised The Enemy Within campaign for the next couple of years.
Yora
Legend
I think the game as presented in the 5th edition Player's Handbook has its merits and is something I'm okay with running. But all the Character Option books never called out to me, and what I hear second hand from people discussing that content, they turn the game into something much weirder and nontraditional than I want to run.
If I would even be considered a 5th edition player, I'd been split off from the evolving game just after it was first released.
If I would even be considered a 5th edition player, I'd been split off from the evolving game just after it was first released.
humble minion
Legend
If it was me doing it (spoiler alert - it's not) I'd present as much as possible of 5.5 as 'options' rather than actual changes. So when you get a Ranger class feature at level 6, for instance, you'd get to choose from a list, including the original PHB feature, or the Tasha's alternate feature, or whatever. Give the monk a d10 hit dice and fix some of the more feeble subclasses while you're at it if you must, and I suspect nobody will complain.
Spell changes being back compatible isn't as big a deal as it was back in 3.x, simply because the Concentration limit means that there's fewer module encounters or PC builds that rely on the complicated interaction of seven different stacking buff spells. Will it probably screw over those people who've built some finely optimised Booming Blade Hexblade/Paladin monstrosity or similar? Well, yeah, inevitably. When you stretch the rules to the edge case, and the rules change to fix up the edges, you're gonna get cut. And frankly, that doesn't bother me at all.
Spell changes being back compatible isn't as big a deal as it was back in 3.x, simply because the Concentration limit means that there's fewer module encounters or PC builds that rely on the complicated interaction of seven different stacking buff spells. Will it probably screw over those people who've built some finely optimised Booming Blade Hexblade/Paladin monstrosity or similar? Well, yeah, inevitably. When you stretch the rules to the edge case, and the rules change to fix up the edges, you're gonna get cut. And frankly, that doesn't bother me at all.
UngeheuerLich
Legend
I don't think, giving too much options is a good Idea for the base game.
But extrapolating from newer release, we will still use dndbeyond in 6e and we will have access to legacy content. So if you atart new, you will likely only see 6e stuff. For those who started before, all options are available.
The new starter set claim to be forward compatible, so I guess we will see 5.25 iterations of a few base races and maybe even classes.
JEB
Legend
Assuming you bought it before it was removed from sale, that is - VGTM and MTOF are no longer available for purchase, and I assume future books (to include the 2014 core rules) will follow suit over time, as their successors are released.
UngeheuerLich
Legend
teitan
Legend
A little, for a little while? Maybe? Depends on if the compatibility is 2e to 2e revised or even 3e to 3.5.
If they go how they went with MotM? probably not. While I am firmly against how they handled that book and what it is in regards to it being reprint material that PROBABLY should have waited until after the revision came out and thought out better and then pulling Volo's and ToF off of D&D Beyond, essentially stripping the lore out digitally, it's a step forward in design for 5e while also remaining wholly in line with the baseline PHB. If these are the sorts of revisions we can expect in the new books then it won't split the base but 5revised will be a slower burn sell. Meaning it will be a slower, more casual adoption. PHB will sell pretty quick and the DMG and Monster Manual will sell much lower than the current edition because they will be in less remand. This would be on par with a 1e to 2e conversion where essentially not a lot changed and a 1e monster was just fine against 2e characters, there wasn't a lot of shuffling to figure out how to adjust things on the fly in a 1e adventure with 2e characters. That's if they bring the races in line with MotM and the classes in line with Xanathar and Tasha's, which, with the gift set being such a big deal, I don't think those two books and Fizban's are going to be "wiped". I think the PHB stuff will be brought in line to the presentation in those two books and the campaign settings. Nothing from them will be in the PHB except maybe the Artificer with 2 new sub-classes.
If it is on par with 3e-3.5 it will be a faster adoption. Just enough tweaks to make conversion difficult on the fly but not enough to make people mad and actually address some of the issues in 5e? All three books will be purchased quickly. Pathfinder did the exact same strategy as 3.5, change enough to smooth out some rough spots and 3.5 players adopted it.
WHat will split the market? Attacking 5e like they did 3.5 as part of their marketing. Changing the core of the game too much. 3e succeeded because the game needed to change while acknowledging its roots and that D&D itself is the genre, not generic fantasy. They streamlined properly, they made it cohesive and easier to explain. 4e struggled in comparison because they attacked a beloved game and changed it from the ground up acting like the older stuff was something to be cherry picked and the rest was for old men in their mother's basements and gnomes were stupid.
I fully expect it to be more like 1e to 2e where they are largely the same with the tweaks being what we've seen with a couple surprises but nothing major. It's not "broke". The only failure would be if they do what TSR did when they did the revised 2e books and actually made them uglier. This will mean slower sales on the DMG and MM but the PHB will be a hot item and the former 2 will take about a year or so to really show teeth after a big initial sales hit. If they release too many products a year though, sales will fall flat on them. The rapid clip release schedule will short the game's lifepan.
If they go how they went with MotM? probably not. While I am firmly against how they handled that book and what it is in regards to it being reprint material that PROBABLY should have waited until after the revision came out and thought out better and then pulling Volo's and ToF off of D&D Beyond, essentially stripping the lore out digitally, it's a step forward in design for 5e while also remaining wholly in line with the baseline PHB. If these are the sorts of revisions we can expect in the new books then it won't split the base but 5revised will be a slower burn sell. Meaning it will be a slower, more casual adoption. PHB will sell pretty quick and the DMG and Monster Manual will sell much lower than the current edition because they will be in less remand. This would be on par with a 1e to 2e conversion where essentially not a lot changed and a 1e monster was just fine against 2e characters, there wasn't a lot of shuffling to figure out how to adjust things on the fly in a 1e adventure with 2e characters. That's if they bring the races in line with MotM and the classes in line with Xanathar and Tasha's, which, with the gift set being such a big deal, I don't think those two books and Fizban's are going to be "wiped". I think the PHB stuff will be brought in line to the presentation in those two books and the campaign settings. Nothing from them will be in the PHB except maybe the Artificer with 2 new sub-classes.
If it is on par with 3e-3.5 it will be a faster adoption. Just enough tweaks to make conversion difficult on the fly but not enough to make people mad and actually address some of the issues in 5e? All three books will be purchased quickly. Pathfinder did the exact same strategy as 3.5, change enough to smooth out some rough spots and 3.5 players adopted it.
WHat will split the market? Attacking 5e like they did 3.5 as part of their marketing. Changing the core of the game too much. 3e succeeded because the game needed to change while acknowledging its roots and that D&D itself is the genre, not generic fantasy. They streamlined properly, they made it cohesive and easier to explain. 4e struggled in comparison because they attacked a beloved game and changed it from the ground up acting like the older stuff was something to be cherry picked and the rest was for old men in their mother's basements and gnomes were stupid.
I fully expect it to be more like 1e to 2e where they are largely the same with the tweaks being what we've seen with a couple surprises but nothing major. It's not "broke". The only failure would be if they do what TSR did when they did the revised 2e books and actually made them uglier. This will mean slower sales on the DMG and MM but the PHB will be a hot item and the former 2 will take about a year or so to really show teeth after a big initial sales hit. If they release too many products a year though, sales will fall flat on them. The rapid clip release schedule will short the game's lifepan.
Similar Threads
