Is The Keep on the Borderlands a well-designed adventure module?

[Rothe]

Mike Mearls's 'review' of B2 is bizarre. Some kind of satire? It's a collection of personal and above all theoretical nitpicks in place of any discussion of what the module's like to DM or play.

It's amusing as satire; I'm not sure if he is serious myself. I think B2 has excellent design albeit a bare-bones one. The design allows for me plenty of versimulitude and explaination by this old ecologist. I'm more of a "work with it" approach instead of a "fighting the hypothetical" approach when it comes to dungeon rationalization.

Some reasons why I think it is excellent. First, it allows for parley and not just hack-n-slash should players wish, or they can just hack-n-slash. Second, as ruleslaywer so well put it:

What should module designers try to emulate from it? Well, I think most of them know by now. I haven't seen an adventure worth buying that doesn't have clear guidelines for resolving Gather Information and Knowledge checks and doesn't allow the PCs to get through encounters with intelligent opponents by exploiting factional rivalries or just roleplaying.

Although, I believe Judges Guilds with Dark Tower and Caverns of Thracia had all these things before TSR modules started with them. Third, the set up provides a place to go back to again and again without the whole dungeon up in arms against them, the good old CE nature working for. In fact, if you weaken one faction maybe another eats them and takes there stuff before you return again. Just great for begining play.

Why do I think it provides versimilitude/ecology? The very set up admits of it to me, you have ready access to the outside so the humanoids can eat: insects, fish, rats, bats, etc. and each other, with the dietary supplement of raiding. The criticism of no toilets and the "crowding" I think must be toungue in cheek, almost any 19th century city had far worse conditions. It also doesn't surprise me the creatures have some sort of cease-fire going. Likely it breaks down from time to time, especially when a party of walking meat, I mean adventurers, disturbs the power balance. So I don't see the criticism.

Finally it is only 16 or so pages IIRC, it has a lot of adventure in those pages. With computers these days we can decry such a low page count but in 1980 formating and printing large numbers of pages was not so easy or cheap, so bare-bones doesn't surprise me. As a point of comaprison the ~80 page City State of the Invincible Overlord was a "massive" supplement back then and the quality of it's printng left much to be desired.

 

[Hussar]

OTOH, I think you should re-read Keep on the Borderlands. It was certainly assumed that the DM could (and would) do a lot of the background work as to why the characters were there, where the Keep was, and what the background story was. IMHO, the evil power saturating the very stones in the temple cave probably drew the creatures to the area.

The evil saturation of the very stones aside (a point that is certainly not picked out in the module except for one small section), a module that "assumes" that the DM is going to do a lot of work possibly has a strike against it when it comes to saying whether or not it is well designed. If it were well designed, then the DM shouldn't have to do a lot of work.

Me, I say its a well designed training module. It was a great learning tool for how to build a dungeon. It does teach some strange things - toss in random mixes of creatures makes a good adventure - but, by and large, it works.

 

[MerricB]

The Keep on the Borderlands is very close to the best designed adventure module ever. It might even have that status. (I think Pharoah comes close).

Words such as "verisimiltude" have no place in the discussion of the adventure, except to say that KotB shows why it can be overrated. Overall, it's an exceptionally fun introductory adventure for D&D.

Cheers!

 

[Endur]

Best module ever!

What a cover! an elf, dwarf, and human warrior against some foul humanoids on a hill. Great art!

It has
1) A Keep with all the shops the PCs could need, a tavern for fights to take place, several wealthy people for PC thieves to rob, lots of soldiers to arrest PC thieves, etc.
2) A cavern complex that has more humanoids than the Creature Cantina and Jabba the Hutt's palace put together. Fantastic!
3) Outdoor encounters (lizardmen, hermit, giant spiders, and bandits)
4) And the Mysterious Cave of the Unknown

Really, this module has it all.

 

[Silver Moon]

IMO it is the best module ever written for a new DM. It's also good to have a copy around whenever you need an instant castle or instant dungeon.

 

[mearls]

Wow! That review is a blast from the past!

It was meant partially as a satire, partially as a serious question along the lines of, "Would D&D have been more popular, or even mainstream, if B2 had been better designed?"

There was definitely a time when I considered B2 a terrible module. Seven years ago, I had much different ideas of what made a good RPG product than I do today. Of course, seven years ago I wasn't a professional game designer.

Today, I think that B2 is a very interesting model for doing things. I sometimes wonder if this barebones level of design is all that gamers really need. We talk about versimilitude (man, I'm sure I misspelled that), story, detail, and so on, but do we really need a designer to give us that?

I'm running a one shot D&D game for a few people this Saturday. On one hand, I'd like to use one of the many, and quite good, modules I have lying around. On the other hand, it's pretty easy to come up with a story, stat out some NPCs, and run something. For some inexplicable reason - maybe it's the wererat rogue minis I have on my computer - I want to run a city adventure with wererats, a chase through the sewers, a fight in a room with a giant waterfall in the middle, a scene with the strange market hidden beneath the city, and another scene in the equally strange tavern in that market.

In a way, the more detail that a product offers the harder it is for me to fit the story I want to tell into it. The barebones approach, like the one taken by Wilderlands of High Fantasy, makes it really easy to do what you want.

I think part of the reason I'm so excited about the Goodman Games Dungeon Crawl Classic setting is that it really feels like a setting where I can slot in the different stories I want to tell, along with the existing DCCs.

So, I think that B2 is a very interesting design model, one that we haven't really seen in the industry despite the popularity of retro design. It's a good design, and I'd be curious to see what kind of sales numbers a module written in the same style could generate.

Of course, ask me again in seven years and maybe I'll have a different answer.

Interestingly enough, that review prompted Dale Donovan and John Tynes to email me (they had very different reactions), and the RPG.net admin at the time (Sandy Antunes?) asked if I wanted to do a column for the site. It sort of helped me break into the business. Ironic, isn't it?

 

[Votan]

It is an ingeresting generic module with lots of options to base an interesting campaign out of. It might be a little cliche and the ecology is a bit bizarre, but it was fun to play and well designed for having a good evening. Running through the module leads to a good balance between reward, risk and interesting situations.

Clearly, I voted yes.

 

[Akrasia]

... Interestingly enough, that review prompted Dale Donovan and John Tynes to email me (they had very different reactions), and the RPG.net admin at the time (Sandy Antunes?) asked if I wanted to do a column for the site. It sort of helped me break into the business. Ironic, isn't it?

Ah, so that review was a disaster in more than one way ...

 

[Emirikol]

What kind of armor are they wearing on the cover (BD&D listing?)

jh

 

[The Shaman]

If it were well designed, then the DM shouldn't have to do a lot of work.

That may be your idea of well-designed, but it isn't mine. A good design for me is one that provides a sufficient framework and allows me to personalize the details to fit the setting, the adventurers, and my own style behind the screen. I want the recipe - the list of ingredients isn't enough, and the finished dish is too much.

Based on those criteria, KotB is a great design.