Is the RPG Industry on Life Support? (Merged w/"Nothing Dies")

[Psion]

In fact, I've been on a dozen or more of those "State of the Industry" panels at cons and they almost always go like this:

Person A: The industry is in the toilet.
Person B: Yeah, things aren't good.
Person C: Well, MY company is doing great.

How do the people listening figure out who to believe? The truth is, all three could be correct.

Yup.

But the thing is, I find that when people post threads like this, they are looking at a certain subset of the industry and generalize it to the rest of the industry. They see a subset of the industry that they are in tune with (usually meaning the publisher of their favorite game or style of game) doing poorly and make statement based on that. OR worse (as seems to be the case in this thread) see something that won't sell to them, and decides that nobody else would buy such a thing, which actually seems not to be the case.

There have been big players phasing in and out of the industry for some time. And there are stable companies too. I think the trick comes in realizing that change is to be expected, and that one or a few lines or publishers is not the pulse of the entire industry.

 

[Kid Charlemagne]

I have a number of questions that would need answering before I would accept that the industry is in anymore trouble than it has been in for the past twenty years.

1. When folks say there are fewer players now, how do they know? My understanding is that the only comprehensive survey done of gaming habits was done around 1999 as part of the research leading up to 3E.

2. Is there anyone out there collecting objective data on the gaming industry? Considering that pretty much the entire industry is privately held, is it even possible to know the state of the industry?

3. People say the industry is doing poorly, especially one would imagine for smaller publishers. However, those guys never made much money from what I understand. Is it actually worse, or is it just a batch of new guys who are suddenly realizing that the RPG industry has never made anyone rich?

 

[Wulf Ratbane]

Is it actually worse, or is it just a batch of new guys who are suddenly realizing that the RPG industry has never made anyone rich?

That has the ring of truth to it...

 

[Lord Judas]

A few random points, all IMO.

Books are not going anywhere. Both my daughters like books, even though the 3 year old cant read. Even with a perfectly indexed and linked PDF, I still find it faster to flip to a page thats bookmarked and get info. Besides, I cant forsee lugging my laptop into the crapper to read a page or two vs. grabbing the Monster Manual (or other item).

As for state of the industry, I recall someone saying Egames would be "everything" before Magic The Gathering hit the scene. I was also around when people said "video games are dead" in 1984. And so it goes...

I think its cyclic as others have suggested. When one type of game gets 'played out' people start looking elsewhere and other genres pick up again.

 

[mearls]

A friend who just got back from GenCon Socal was relating to me one of the seminars he sat through on the State of the RPG Industry. Besides relating that the news was on the depressing side, he confirmed something that I have suspected for the last year or so… that the industry is losing players.

Dude, all you need is a few arms, maybe some legs, a vague ability to speak English, and a burning desire to feel important become a game convention guest of honor. Unless someone from Hasbro or White Wolf stood up and showed you certified sales numbers, a few pie charts, and maybe a powerpoint presentation, I wouldn't believe anything.

At WorldCon, Teresa Nielsen-Hayden offered up this pearl of wisdom: When you ask someone how the industry is doing, they invariably answer with how they, personally, are doing in it. That applies to SF publishing, and it definitely applies to RPGs.

The industry is using fewer freelancers these days. There's a hint of desperation in the air - I'm not surprised that everything is gloom and doom on various fronts. But that doesn't mean that everyone is gloomin' and doomin'.

 

[Thornir Alekeg]

I cant forsee lugging my laptop into the crapper to read a page or two vs. grabbing the Monster Manual (or other item).

Note to self: if you meet Lord Judas, do NOT ask to borrow his books...

 

[barsoomcore]

No attempt has ever been made to market RPGs to educated, creative adults who are not already players.

I am having so much success in this arena it's stupid. I've got STEWARDESSES playing D&D. My wife has made it her personal mission to bring in educated, creative adults who are not already players.

There's a HUGE market if somebody can figure out a way of reaching them. I don't know how, myself, but there's a lot of PHB sales for the company that does.

Er. Hey, remember what Monte said about it all being WotC? Yeah, I thought you did.

 

[Krypter]

No offense, Barsoomcore, but since when are stewardesses part of the "creative, educated" elite set? Stewardesses may be hot, but if they had an ounce of education they wouldn't be serving cheap wine to drunk businessmen on airplanes.

That said, I'll rather have a stewardess in my game instead of a professor any day!

 

[Arcane Runes Press]

No offense, Barsoomcore, but since when are stewardesses part of the "creative, educated" elite set? Stewardesses may be hot, but if they had an ounce of education they wouldn't be serving cheap wine to drunk businessmen on airplanes.

That's an incredibly smug statement, and one that makes you sound like an arrogant jerk.

 

[barsoomcore]

No offense, Barsoomcore, but since when are stewardesses part of the "creative, educated" elite set?

Three things:

One -- go read my Wild Stewardess Action Story Hour and tell me who's creative now, bucko. These ladies are MASSIVE on the creativity front. They kick butt with wit, humour and clever thinking. Some of the best players I've ever had.

Two -- Free travel anywhere in the world, the chance to party it up in Hong Kong, Berlin, Paris, Rio, and New York on a regular basis, the need to speak three languages (that's for Air Canada, anyway), and good money for what is sometimes only a few days' worth of work per month? Guess your job must be pretty frickin' awesome if you can sneer at somebody with a gig like that.

It's not for me, but it's a heckuva long way from the worst job I ever heard of. MOST jobs I've had are worse than theirs.

Three -- these are my friends you're pissing on, so maybe you could scale it back a little, there. Not real funny, even if it was meant to be.