Is this a cruel DM?

[Heathen72]

First of all, You don't have to keep on playing in this GM's Game. If it is as bad as you feel it is, then get out.

But if you love your character, and want to continue playing, don't continually blame the GM for being a prick. That is METAGAME thinking. Instead of saying "The GM is a bastard," have your character grimly comment on "how cruel this bleak world is." or (more optimistically) talk about how your Patron God/Goddess must be testing you, and how you have remained (or have tried to remain) true.

hates the world that hasn't rewarded him for his heroics to this point, etc.

Ah... Your one of those "What's in it for me?" type Heroes huh? It's easy to be a hero when everything is treasure, babes and new spells. The true heroes are the ones that stay true when the times are tough.

Become a selfish individual who is primarily looking out for himself now. He isn't going out of his way to hurt anyone, but he certainly doesn't go out of his way to help anyone either, including his comrades. In effect, he becomes a "me first" individual and to heck with anyone else. The world hasn't helped him, why should he help anyone else. Effectively a CN type of character.

This sounds like a cop-out to me. It sounds like you don't like what happening to your character - so you are changing him into a different person. Be true to your character and his beliefs. It's one thing to become bitter and twisted, and even angry at how things have turned out, but to do this or "turn evil" (as you said in an earlier thread) would be throwing away the core of your character. If you are so ready to throw away your character's beliefs it sounds to me as if they weren't too strong to begin with.

If you do decide to break down and turn to drink, or lose your faith etc be aware that the character has broken down, and treat it as such. Don't be too flippant about such a change.

Remember Lancelot in Excalibur/i]? How he betrayed the
King and left the court. When Percival meets him years later he is bitter and angry, railing against the Knights of the round table and so on. But finally, in the battle against Mordred he returns, still the best warrior, after all these years. it's stirring stuff.
You can go through this too, if you stay true to the character.

Of course, as I said at the start, if you don't think that things are going to get better, you could just tell your GM to get stuffed.

 

[Ravellion]

Ah... Your one of those "What's in it for me?" type Heroes huh? It's easy to be a hero when everything is treasure, babes and new spells. The true heroes are the ones that stay true when the times are tough.

Well after 3years of playing, I would get to the point of Metagame thinking too. And it isn't that bad, if it happens out of game (Yes, out of game metagame thinking).

Rav

 

[LokiDR]

Just a bit of background. We have all played D&D since 1st Edition, although we have only been playing together for the past 3 years. I know for a fact that we have all played in different types of campaigns, including evil ones, so I think that if properly role-played, the other characters likely won't have a problem with it given our experience level in RPG's. Given my character's current state, I'm not sure that it isn't an appropriate response.

The way I see it, the character could either react in the manner that I suggested, or he could become a LG holy roller as a sort of "abomination hunter". In any event, such a shocking series of events, including the knowledge that you consumed another party member (sorry to be so graphic), would most likely lead to "breakdown" of some sort.

But, it may be a good suggestion to at least give the rest of the party a sense as to what has happened so as not to create ill will out of the game.

Even good role players can get miffed when they are screwed by a party member. If you were going to try that, I would suggest you talk to the other players first. Speaking of other players, what is their take on this? If they think the game is fine, maybe you are being singled out for some reason.

As for a future for your character in game, I can only provide a few pieces of advice. First: if you know you killed and ate a comrade that is a great trauma, but you don't remember it. Unless you know that, I don't know that you have a great reason to rethink your whole personality.

If you have just had a great trauma, follow the steps a person normally does: denial, anger, fear, bargining, and acceptance. First, try to act normally, maybe while you have those conversations with your DM. Next, I could see your character getting angry at the world that screwed him, and refusing to help as much as he did. After that, starting getting more paranoid, and keep what little you have to yourself. Refuse to heal others in combat, never use up expendable items. Finally, get back to who you character really is, maybe with a health dose of anti-lycanthrope feelings.

My point here is that people do not suddenly become different people from just bad experiences, they only get personality quirks. All of this assumes you want to stay in the game. If every one else likes the game but you don't, it might be best just to leave.

 

[Prince Atom]

I ran in a game last weekend that was similar, in that there were plenty of items out there, but few in the PCs' possession.

The DM played with his own item destruction rules in play. The items were supposed to have a better chance of survival than the DMG gives, but I didn't see that happening. A simple Snilloc's Snowball Swarm took out three magic items!

I'm just dreading the time when the DM springs DR creatures on us and only a few have weapons to overcome the DR. We'll complain and he'll say "That's not my fault" because it was pure luck that we survived with as many items as we did.

[/bitter]

Sigh....

TWK

 

[Voadam]

Here is what I think will happen if you continue on your quest without getting cured. You will hit a combat and think, hey, I've got weapons and not much else, what can I do? You then might think it will be a good tactical idea to change into rat form. Especially if your character does not have in depth knowledge about lycanthropy as written and by the book. Once you voluntarily change your alignment automatically changes to that of the werecreature (Lawful evil for the wererat). No warning, no save. You might then consider switching to a new god or philosophy so you can use cure lights again.

Alternatively, the party might realistically leave and try to get cured and make the best of it. The evil grows unchecked but you can't win them all. Let the church know about it, say you gave it your best shot, but it is beyond your abilities. If you can't completely defeat the big bad evil, you can still do good in other little ways.

As a character, assuming you get cured of the mummy rot and out of the dungeon, you can either continue as a wizard and rebuild your spellbook leaning heavily upon advancement for the free spells, or go all multiclass and use your wizardry for wands only and rebuild your spell book as you can but consider it a minor aspect of the character.

 

[Methos]

You know, I would tend to agree with you. It appears that there are other posters out there who seem to think that a player who actually wants to become herioc, and get some treasure and magic items and not have a DM capriciously take them away must be METAGAMING!!

Sorry, I think that is a cop out. A big part of D&D is to imagine yourself becoming a mighty hero and wielding powerful magic, and battling powerful monsters. And, by the way, maybe gaining a little treasure along the way.

I'm going to take this to the extreme, since we already have faced as 4th and 5th level characters a CR 14 creature, which fundamentally goes against some of the basic tenets of the game where your CR should not exceed your average party level by 2 or is it 3? I don't have my books in front of me, so I'm not sure.

So, let's assume that we as a party make it to 15-16th level. Here's a scenario.

DM: "You step through the portal. All of your party's magic items and mundane items disappear, and all spellcasters have their spells for the day wiped from memory and psions lose all of their remaining power points for the day. Standing before you are 2 Balors".

Players: "We go back through the portal the other way".

DM: "Sorry, you can't. It is a one-way portal".

Players: "We look for an exit".

DM: "There appear to be no exits".

Players: "We disbelieve; this must be an illusion".

DM: "No effect". "The Balors attacks"........and so it goes.

Instant kill. Gee, it really is easy to be a DM after all, as the DM chuckles maniacally.

Sorry, but I'm a little sarcastic when it comes to people who use the words "Metagaming", it's sort of like "name-dropping" in the Corporate World.

Well after 3years of playing, I would get to the point of Metagame thinking too. And it isn't that bad, if it happens out of game (Yes, out of game metagame thinking).

Rav

 

[Methos]

As for a future for your character in game, I can only provide a few pieces of advice. First: if you know you killed and ate a comrade that is a great trauma, but you don't remember it. Unless you know that, I don't know that you have a great reason to rethink your whole personality.

If you have just had a great trauma, follow the steps a person normally does: denial, anger, fear, bargining, and acceptance. First, try to act normally, maybe while you have those conversations with your DM. Next, I could see your character getting angry at the world that screwed him, and refusing to help as much as he did. After that, starting getting more paranoid, and keep what little you have to yourself. Refuse to heal others in combat, never use up expendable items. Finally, get back to who you character really is, maybe with a health dose of anti-lycanthrope feelings.

My point here is that people do not suddenly become different people from just bad experiences, they only get personality quirks. All of this assumes you want to stay in the game. If every one else likes the game but you don't, it might be best just to leave.

Actually he does know that he and the other wererat ate the party member. They saw the remains when they woke up the next day. And since there was no way out of the room they were in, and the other pieces belonged to the dead party member, they knew the deceased.

In addition, they knew that they fought wererats earlier and possibly were infected. (Knowledge check on abominations).

As far as drastic changes based on bad experiences. Unless you have a psychology degree (and even then I'm not so sure), you would not be able to predict what a person may or may not do. From a dramatic/role-playing perspective, ever see the Dracula movie by Coppola a few years ago, Gary Oldman renounces his god after his fiance dies while he is off "saving the world". A perfect example of someone completely changing, and being bitter at the world around him.

Cheers

 

[Methos]

METAGAMER

But if you love your character, and want to continue playing, don't continually blame the GM for being a prick. That is METAGAME thinking.

By the way, based on my reading of the lycanthrope template, and some other posters on this board, the DM's view of the wererats running around destroying stuff may not fit with the true nature of a "ravening beast". A feral creature may well try to escape its cage after looking after its hunger (we did that!).

Nowhere in the template does it imply that a ravening beast will simply destroy everything in sight. Wild animals don't necessarily do that in real life.

So, I think the DM may simply have been projecting his opinion and view of a gothic, harsh world onto the characters who were now under HIS control, not ours. Our actions did nothing to imply that the DM should assume we destroy anything. In fact, if we were ravening beasts, maybe we should have attacked each other with the winner eating the other wererat? It is just as plausible.

My point is that METAGAMING can work both ways - The DM and the player can both be guilty of it.

Cheers

 

[Xarlen]

Methos, I have to thank you for replying to the posts presented rather promptly. It's just nice to see someone who will reply soon, and thorough.

 

[LokiDR]

Actually he does know that he and the other wererat ate the party member. They saw the remains when they woke up the next day. And since there was no way out of the room they were in, and the other pieces belonged to the dead party member, they knew the deceased.

In addition, they knew that they fought wererats earlier and possibly were infected. (Knowledge check on abominations).

As far as drastic changes based on bad experiences. Unless you have a psychology degree (and even then I'm not so sure), you would not be able to predict what a person may or may not do. From a dramatic/role-playing perspective, ever see the Dracula movie by Coppola a few years ago, Gary Oldman renounces his god after his fiance dies while he is off "saving the world". A perfect example of someone completely changing, and being bitter at the world around him.

Cheers

I don't have a psychology degree, so this is only friendly advice. I was more aiming at a dark and girtty decline that might fit the campaign better. Dracula is a folk tale. There are other ways to do a decline to madness, maybe while tring to work things out with the DM. Sudden shifts of personality do happen in real life, but they are comparablely rare, unless mind altering drugs are involved.

I am only trying to give you a different perspective on the game. The sudden shift to nasty might be seen as just being spitefull. Maybe that is what you want. I wouldn't blame you, I did the same thing. If you want an interesting experience, this kind of decline might expand your options and you role playing experience. Take it for what it's worth.