Is this an appropriate challenge for 6-7 level 2s? (My players stay out!)

[Nail]

Question to those who say that there's too man encounters on day 1... I thought that it was intended that there be 4 encounters a day?

Really: YMMV.

By the book, if CR = APL (or rather, if EL = APL), then they should be able to do 4 encounters (and use 80% of their resources).

I've found that (as a DM), I can plan 4 encounters per day....and the PCs will do their best to lay low after encounter 2 or 3. It really depends on

• The challenge (EL = APL?...etc.), and
• the player's inclinations ("Charge!" or "Let's think about this first..."), and
• the perception of the DM's style.

My players know I play rough. So they know if they've used 75% of their resources (spells especially), they're in serious trouble if they hit another encounter.

How well do these players know your DMing style?

 

[Nail]

Just crunching some numbers:

The Party: six level 2 PCs
APL: 3.2


Day 1: EL 4, then EL 4, then EL 4, and finally a EL 4

Check that out: all encounters are calculated to be above the APL, and therefore difficult.

***************

Day 2: EL 4, then just a EL 3

Again, nothing that would be calculated as "easy"

***************

Dungeon: EL 3 (depending on how you treat Spot checks, BTW), then an EL 5, then EL 3, then EL 1, then EL 1

Heck, it looks like the Dungeon has the easiest list!

 

[Amitiel]

Just crunching some numbers:

The Party: six level 2 PCs
APL: 3.2


Day 1: EL 4, then EL 4, then EL 4, and finally a EL 4

Check that out: all encounters are calculated to be above the APL, and therefore difficult.

***************

Day 2: EL 4, then just a EL 3

Again, nothing that would be calculated as "easy"

***************

Dungeon: EL 3 (depending on how you treat Spot checks, BTW), then an EL 5, then EL 3, then EL 1, then EL 1

Heck, it looks like the Dungeon has the easiest list!

The problem is the EL vs. APL calculations are faulty if you have more or less than 4 players. Hell the EL's calculations are based on number of ability types not what they do if they even bothered, a lot of critters thier CR=HD rather than true destructive capability. Others are rated above thier true abilities. A 6th level Troll Barbarian is still a EL11 even though it is a great deal more lethal than many CR11 critters.

My current party is made up of 3 party members and 2 cohorts Thier current APL is 11, but some of the EL11 stuff I run them through they just breeze by, other times they struggle with EL8, it really depends on party make-up and preparadness. The animal encounters will depend on party tactics. He already said he's foreshadowing the mummy so as long as they know its coming it will be down to luck of the save.

 

[Nail]

The problem is the EL vs. APL calculations are faulty if you have more or less than 4 players.

It's only faulty if it doesn't take more party members into account. The calculation I used did.

 

[James McMurray]

I've found that with large parties it's best to up the challenge level of encounters by adding more monsters instead of making them bigger. A larger party can handle larger groups of enemies, but are still made of paper when it comes to higher CR creatures.

 

[Amitiel]

It's only faulty if it doesn't take more party members into account. The calculation I used did.

While I would be interested in the maths of the system you used for the calcs it still doesn't stop the EL of the creatures from being off. Actually according to your APL3.2 EL4 is depending on party make-up challenging to push-over.

 

[Asmor]

I've found that with large parties it's best to up the challenge level of encounters by adding more monsters instead of making them bigger. A larger party can handle larger groups of enemies, but are still made of paper when it comes to higher CR creatures.

Yeah, that's a conclusion I've started to come to independently...

It's kind of annoying because I already rolled up all the treasure and stuff for the encounters using the higher CR critters... I'm just going to keep the treasure I rolled up because it's not worth all the time and effort just make sure that they're not getting like a tenth too much treasure or something.

 

[werk]

I've found that with large parties it's best to up the challenge level of encounters by adding more monsters instead of making them bigger. A larger party can handle larger groups of enemies, but are still made of paper when it comes to higher CR creatures.

That's so true, and so beautiful, it needed to be quoted and read over and over.

I've found that with large parties it's best to up the challenge level of encounters by adding more monsters instead of making them bigger. A larger party can handle larger groups of enemies, but are still made of paper when it comes to higher CR creatures.

It's really why the BBEG is so B and B.

 

[Nail]

While I would be interested in the maths of the system you used ...

Not my system...I take no credit. It's right here, in one of the SRD sites.

Actually according to your APL3.2 EL4 is depending on party make-up challenging to push-over.

Quite possibly.

Given the PCs are 2nd level, though, they are "made of paper", so the encounters are probably on the challenging side. A good stiff wind will...._________.

 

[evilbob]

I've found that with large parties it's best to up the challenge level of encounters by adding more monsters instead of making them bigger. A larger party can handle larger groups of enemies, but are still made of paper when it comes to higher CR creatures.

Exactly my thoughts, and my own experience as well. Seconded.