Is this what you went through with 3rd Edition?

[keterys]

And we all saw how initiative worked out...
... maybe dragon boobies are a good thing.

 

[EricNoah]

My old site's forums (the precursor to the EN World forums) were estbablished by a pro 3E person (that'd be me!) and attracted a pro 3E crowd. Its purpose was to learn about and get excited about the new edition. There was a lot of arguing going on in other places -- WotC's newsgroup/forum thingy, Usenet, etc. But it was pretty subdued here because of the nature and purpose of the site.

In some ways, then, this 4E situation is quite a bit different. Russ and the mods are (admirably, I think) trying to "have it all" by catering to both sides. Both sides, by and large are doing a pretty good job of not crapping on other people's fun, though there are extremes on both sides.

And there is a further difference with far-reaching impact -- the OGL, which will keep 3.x alive in a way that 2E couldn't be. If there's a market for it, 3.x can be eternal. (That's what makes this Paizo thing so interesting to me.) So the possible "fade out" of 3.x posters here might not happen at all, if the game doesn't really "fade" as one might have expected of 2E after 3E came out.

 

[Patlin]

I played basic, expert and AD&D but skipped 2e enitrely in favor of a home brew system. 2e seemed to screw up more than it fixed, but 3e was a whole new game that I've really enjoyed. Our group is excited about 4e, and their were a lot of comments last session as how the 4e rules were a lot better suited to our style of play. At least for my group, we like what we're hearing.

3e had no competition from 2e for me, but generated little excitement as I wasn't playing D&D at the time -- lots of RPGs, but not D&D. 4e is generating a lot of excitement.

 

[Psion]

What, exactly, are you demanding?

D&D has always been a game about being heroes and kicking butt. Anything more is something that came from you.

Incorrect. And I don't know why you are coming at the argument from that direction; I never even implied it was a roleplaying thing or that 4e would be wanting in this way.

D&D to me has also been defined by common elements that have been part of the ruleset and (growing) metasetting since 1e and before. Dryads as beautiful forest spirits instead of treants with bewbs, evil chromatic and good metallic dragons, lawful good paladins, Gnomes, bards, the planes, all those things are definitive of D&D to me, and did not "come from me", and are being unceremoniously chucked aside for the first round of 4e books.

If I wanted a bevy on new races or whatnot, I could have got that from Arcana Evolved or Talislanta a long time ago. But they presented something I didn't want from my fantasy gaming experience.

 

[Vempyre]

My old site's forums (the precursor to the EN World forums)

Now you just made me nostalgic. I remember checking your site month n months n month before 3E ever came out, hehe, so I could get information about it. Not that I ever posted very often in there or the old ENWorld boards anyway, but a great way to get info on the new version. I am usually a bit of an eternal lurker. (Except these last 2 weeks it seems, hehe)

 

[EricNoah]

Oh I get nostalgaic too.

I have an unhealthy aversion to conflict so I'm probably not the best judge, but there are times when the constant air of conflict here bothers me to a great degree. We are adults who should be able to interact with each other in a civil and friendly manner. But I'm seeing this conflict bring out ugly, snarky sides of posters I thought I knew and who are surprising me with their persistent rudeness. I know the conflict is unavoidable, but still...

 

[Arkhandus]

Yes to the OP's question before the last.

Ppl like to complain. That will go away soon enough. (Does any significant amount of ppl still really play 2nd edition as a comparison?)

*Raises hand* I do. I started with 2E. But I still prefer 3E most of the time.

I was hesitant about 3E at first, especially since I had just gotten comfortable with 2E at the time, but I found it easier to achieve the same understanding and comfort with the rules and all that had taken me longer in 2E.

 

[SteveC]

I would say that the situation with 4E is very similar to 3E in terms of what was said, the difference is that it was different people who were saying it back then. I fondly remember having ... spirited ... discussions with Justin Bacon back then. If I remember correctly, Psion was involved with those as well (which is somewhat ironic in that he doesn't seem to care for 4E).

I was on Usenet back in the day, and it was a very negative place, with many of the old school posters on Enworld discussing the developments and having many of the same arguments we're having now.

Time will tell if the result is the same this time around, with the vast majority of gamers moving from 3 to 4 like they did from 2 to 3. I said in a thread in General that I thought that 85-90% of current 3X players would make the migration over, and I think that's a good figure. I think they will be either on board for 4E or playing an entirely different system (i.e., no longer with 3X either).

--Steve

 

[PeterWeller]

Incorrect. And I don't know why you are coming at the argument from that direction; I never even implied it was a roleplaying thing or that 4e would be wanting in this way.

D&D to me has also been defined by common elements that have been part of the ruleset and (growing) metasetting since 1e and before. Dryads as beautiful forest spirits instead of treants with bewbs, evil chromatic and good metallic dragons, lawful good paladins, Gnomes, bards, the planes, all those things are definitive of D&D to me, and did not "come from me", and are being unceremoniously chucked aside for the first round of 4e books.

If I wanted a bevy on new races or whatnot, I could have got that from Arcana Evolved or Talislanta a long time ago. But they presented something I didn't want from my fantasy gaming experience.

Ahh, okay. You're upset with the fluff changes, but you said it your self, "the first round of 4E books," and as far as gnomes, LG pallies, and evil chromatic dragons are concerned, they don't seem to be as chucked to the side as you say. Aside from the planes and arguably, the druids, all of that is still part of D&D, and what's different is still very much in the spirit of D&D.

 

[danbuter1]

I was generally pretty excited about 3e, though I did want armor type vs S/C/P kept and also liked weapon speeds. I no longer miss weapon speeds, but I really wish the S/C/P division had been kept in the game.