Is WoTC even relevant to you anymore?

[SHARK]

Greetings!

Well, I would like to think as gamers, as customers--we are relevant to WOTC. Having said that, there does seem to be some crazy trends they are going in that are at significant odds with much of the *core base*. How that works out in the end, well, that's harder to say.

*shrugs*

In any event, I have a personal collection of game books and modules that is generally as good or better than any game store I have seen, so it isn't like I really *need* WOTC for much of anything.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

 

[pogre]

I run a core-only type campaign, but still find WOTC relevant. I do not buy much in the way of their splat books, but I'm interested in their modules. WOTC is far more relevant to me than D&D was under 2nd ed. So I'm always interested where they are taking the game.

I'm looking forward to 4E. I foresee the following:

- 4E is released and I grab up the rules and convert.
- If I like the game I will stick with D&D, if I do not I will probably switch systems.

It's weird I admit that I will not go back to 3E, even though we enjoy the system. For some reason, having the game supported has become important to me. And I mean supported by the original company who produced the game.

The OGL is what brought me into 3E, but I do not even care if they do an OGL for 4E.

Thankfully, I have WFRP 2E to fall back on if things do not work out with D&D

 

[Raven Crowking]

This is a joke right? WotC goes down, so does the hobby at large

I've heard that one before. It sounded like this: "If TSR goes down, so does the hobby at large."

Not that I want WotC to go down...I don't...but the hobby exists because we enjoy playing these sorts of games, not because of any corporation. At the very least, I would still run games without the least bit of trouble. I suspect you would be able to as well.

In fact, that there are so many people still playing 1e, RC D&D, and even OD&D, should tell you that a game doesn't have to be in print to be alive.

RC

 

[Shadeydm]

Well, I count myself among those who were pretty unhappy about the cancelation of Dragon and Dungeon as printed gaming material. Yet despite my reaction when I think about the last few books I have purchased (FC:2, Dungeonscape, Complete Scoundrel, MIC, Sinister Spire) I can say for sure that WotC is still relevant to me. I really liked all of these products and in some way they have restored my faith in the company. I am now at least willing to see what the DI has to offer.

 

[Fifth Element]

I am now at least willing to see what the DI has to offer.

The internet demands that you pass judgment now!

 

[DragonLancer]

Aside from a few miniatures, I can't even recall the last WoTC book I purchased. Really, I stopped caring about their crunch-heavy books a LONG time ago.

These days, I mostly track new releases from Necromancer games, and that's about all I care about anymore.

WoTC could just about go out of business and I think I'd hardly miss them at all.


Anyone else in the same boat?

I still buy WotC material, just not a lot of it. These days I tend to only buy their monster books and modules.

 

[Vocenoctum]

Greetings!

Well, I would like to think as gamers, as customers--we are relevant to WOTC. Having said that, there does seem to be some crazy trends they are going in that are at significant odds with much of the *core base*. How that works out in the end, well, that's harder to say.

*shrugs*

It's worth noting that while one hand is wondering why WotC never has new innovative material, the other hand is decrying any change in focus.

One customer complains that the books are too fire & forget and rarely updated or referenced again, while another customer complains that this single book is the sign of how all stuff will be.

Folks complained that monster descriptions with lairs are padding the word count, others complain that they need more pre-rendered material to make their game easier...

WotC does seem to listen to their fans, even if they don't always respond in person to such threads. OTOH, my drifting from Paizo's magazines was barely a blip because they listened so intently to what I regard as fanboi's that kept them from innovating, instead churning out more of the same and rendering them worthless to me.

In any event, I have a personal collection of game books and modules that is generally as good or better than any game store I have seen, so it isn't like I really *need* WOTC for much of anything.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

I tend to think on the fly a bit too much to make pre-generated adventures work smoothly for me, and heaven knows we don't NEED anything else. I've got so many bookcases full of stuff I'll never use, I could subsist on it for eternity.

That said, what I seek from WotC products is two things;
1) Take over some tedium. (So, I won't use adventures, but I'm not drawing a map, and the encounters are plucked easily enough, so I buy stuff. In fact, Delve encounters are perfect for this, if they'd just come out with themed Delves by EL, I'd do great!)
2) Inspiration. Sure Incarnum has issues, but it was so inspiring to read through, and quite fun. Same with Tome of Battle and plenty of other books. Heroes of Horror was probably one of the easiest rule books to read in forever.


I do think this forum has too many people trying to find fault with a WotC product, and find quality with a 3rd party book. WotC comes out with a villain book and it's labeled useless, while a third party gets a handwave and raving applause for bothering to come out with a book on elves.

A whole thread talks about the designers mentioning that since MM1 had the bases covered, they made MM5 more about the average 5 round battle and how to change it. Surely this is a sign of great change in direction... except, they even say they only did it because MM1 already covered the other bases...

Tome of Battle is like Deities & demigods. It was right in the notes that it would add some anime/wuxia feel to D&D, yet folks act like they were sucker punched when it did. D&Dg advertised itself as a collection of stats for gods, and somehow folks were shocked at it.

"I got what I paid for, but I wanted something different!"...

Anyway, just felt like rambling. I could never be a company like this, fans just suck too much to deal with.

 

[Vocenoctum]

I'm looking forward to 4E. I foresee the following:

- 4E is released and I grab up the rules and convert.

Not you, but, I really wish there was some kind of penalty for being wrong about 4e's release date.

We've had a couple years of constant naysayers, and folks who have said they left D&D because 4e is non-OGL miniatures and due Right Now. Plenty of folks fanned the flames of 4e, and they should be penalized for making up this specter to scare folks with, but instead folks just go on about their day, waiting for it to happen.

Everyone that raises the 4e Specter should be forced to have a dunce cap avatar for ever, once it passes their "predicted date" with no 4e. Maybe a new title "I was wrong about 4e, learn from my mistakes!"

 

[Desdichado]

Yes, that's true. But it does nothing to detract from the fact that if Wizards does not make money on D&D, they will cease to publish D&D. Making money on Star Wars has nothing to do with D&D 4E.

You actually can't say that. You don't know if that's true. They may figure that D&D is a bit of a prestige niche market and it's worth it to lose money to keep the line afloat as long as they're recovering it somewhere else. They may decide they want to prime it to put it on the market and sell it to someone else, so they better keep it running. They may simply decide that no matter how much money they lose they can't afford to drop it for some other marketing or customer goodwill reason.

Companies must be profitable. They tend to like lines that are profitable. But there are plenty of examples of companies using sales from a profitable line to prop up sales from a line that brings in a loss, and they keep doing so because they have strategic reasons to keep that line in production despite its losses.

 

[Virel]

As for D&D, WotC has never been relevant to my AD&D game.

I will use maps off of their site but that's it. I very seldom buy new WotC D&D products, because all the ones I've are pretty bad. Some of the 3rd party 3e stuff is decent and I'll buy that to read and steal ideas from on occassion but as for orginal WotC stuff, what I've seen and read isn't even jank, it's chaff. It's probably been almost three years since I've looked at a new WotC product, so I could have missed something in the last few years, that's actually good.

The game went on well before WotC existed, should they fail the game would go on. I've converted several 3e players to AD&D, so if would make it harder to get new players over time if WotC bellied up. My core group is stable so we could go for several years without adding players. At one point we've had to turn several would be new players away, some of them 3e players just wanting to find some sort of D&D game to play in.

WotC is some what relevant to me because I also play Magic the Gathering but I don't play that as much as I did. I think WotC does a fairly good job with MtG and an overall very poor one with the D&D brand.