Knight with Spiked Chain. Broken?

[Raspen]

say its a polearm thats a knights weopen i dont see anything wrong with useing his weopen and the only way for him to do that is take a 5'ft step back?

so what you guys are saying about code of honor is that if im a knight and useing my trusty polearm and someone gets close to me so i cant hit him with my polearm i have to say well i guess i need to take a beating because its not honorable to step back and fight back?

and as for the question do i think that the tatic is fair.... I dont have a problum with it other classes have thier way of defending themselfs each class can deploy some form of physical defence. like a wiz/sor casting slow and moveing and blasting over and over or getting the feat that lets you take 2 move actions in one round and still cast a spell.

 

[satori01]

Keep in mind that a Knight using a Spiked Chain is going to be forgoing the Shield Block class ability, barring of course a buckler and Improved Buckler defense. Also for this tactic to be truly effective the Knight needs Combat Reflexes.

Knights do not get a boatload of feats, so any Knight going this route this is going to be their sticht.

 

[Deset Gled]

Well, its definetally a potent combination, especially at low levels. But it seems to me that this would work with any reach weapon, not just the spiked chain. I don't think the weapon is the real issue here.

Perhaps the best solution is just to move the Defensive Bullwark class feature back a few levels. I'll bet that it seems much less potent once you start facing larger monsters.

 

[Merkuri]

say its a polearm thats a knights weopen i dont see anything wrong with useing his weopen and the only way for him to do that is take a 5'ft step back?

I could see a knight using this "trick" with a polearm, but the only problem is (as Herremann the Wise, and maybe others, have mentioned), the feat is designed to help the knight keep enemies away from his allies. Taking a 5' step back each time is allowing the enemy to get 5' closer to those you are protecting. The whole knight class is designed to attract enemies to the knight and away from other (weaker) allies.

Plus, there's always this problem.

 

[takasi]

I was thinking of two options for my cohort: an archivist or a dwarf female knight (named Patches for her facial hair) who rides a dire boar. I was going to take exotic weapon proficiency (spiked chain).

Then I thought about flight and went with the archivist instead. Still a great tactic though.

 

[pawsplay]

where this really gets punitive is when you throw in Defensive Sweep. Now you draw an AoO if you don't move, but any movement results in an AoO, since you've lost your 5' step to difficult terrain.

Really, your only answer is to summon about a dozen lantern archons and shoot him to death.

 

[Bagpuss]

Though personally, I doubt a knight would stoop that low, if you are focusing on roleplaying. The knight I'm currently playing considers the spiked chain a dishonorable weapon.

As does mine, he's not above having his cohort Cleric of St. Cuthbert cast enlarge person on him if things are looking dicey however.

 

[Bagpuss]

Well, its definetally a potent combination, especially at low levels. But it seems to me that this would work with any reach weapon, not just the spiked chain. I don't think the weapon is the real issue here.

It only works with a spiked chain (or when enlarged), because, while with a reach weapon you would still threaten the area they start in (making it difficult terrain) you only factor in difficult terrain penalties for squares you enter and not the ones you leave. Hence he could take a 5ft step towards you with no movement penalty, and thus not suffer an AoO and have his full attack. Which is why you need to threaten the square they start in and the one they intend to move into.

Personally I don't think the stepping back tactic is that great as there isn't normally the room to do that indefinitely on the battlefield, and has other have pointed out if you are doing this then you are more likely to be leaving you allies open to attacks, which goes against most of the other Knight class abilities.

Also note Spring Attack defeats this combo.

 

[BASHMAN]

Edit: accidental mis-posting. please see the next post.

 

[BASHMAN]

Hi Epochrpg,

Question: Do you think a knight who bases their entire existence on chivalry and honour, a knight who won't even get a flanking bonus because they see such as an unfair advantage would resort to such tactics?

I certainly do.

As the enemy hoardes began to pour through the breach in the wall, all that stood between them and the princess' escape was a lone knight, armed only with a spiked chain, and his courage. As they approached, he called out a mighty challenge [test of mettle] and cried, "none, Shall PASS!" At that he began whirling his chain. Each foe who tried to cross its path paid a dearly for trying, as the knight's chain struck home. THough they tried to surround him like dogs, none could make more than a single swipe against the knight, for fear of his whirling chain, allowing the knight to fight longer so her highness could find safety.

In the above situation, had the knight been simply using a sword and shield, the enemies who saved would just run by him in the non-threatened squares and kill the princess while those who failed would charge the knight (not incuring AOOs) then full attack him the following round (killing him far faster, allowing him to give up the hallway sooner). How is that better?