D&D 5E Krynn's Free Feats: setting-specific or the future of the game?

[TwoSix]

A lot of groups would be better off going to a different system that does the style of play that they want from the jump. Rather than having to fight against the system to get the in-game results that they want.

I don't disagree with this, although implementing something like a simple death flag is no major hack to D&D.

 

[Shardstone]

This is only good for D&D.

Let's make some interesting feats. Let's make some feats that can really help you define the idea of a character, like Actor etc. And let's give those feats out for free. Let people be able to have these cool little tricks unique to them, and who cares if it power creeps? D&D monsters are getting more damage, more attacks, a little easier to hit, and a little less hit points. They might go down faster, and players might get more tools to deal with them, but they'll be giving as well as they get in many cases. For all the griping about it, the new Mordenkainen's rework does at least present a tapestry of challenging creatures that a DM can use to make some hard content, even with 2 more feats added in for free.

5E's inherent balance is not so out of tune as a lot of people think, and the system can take a lot of stress.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

This is only good for D&D.

Let's make some interesting feats. Let's make some feats that can really help you define the idea of a character, like Actor etc. And let's give those feats out for free. Let people be able to have these cool little tricks unique to them, and who cares if it power creeps?

yeah some feats that improve other backgrounds would be nice...

 

[Jaeger]

I have it on good authority from this board that D&D 5e is a low lethality game where it's almost impossible to kill a PC.

If they are a group that runs things pretty much straight up I can believe them.

When my group did Waterdeep heist the GM ran it as intended and at about 5th level I stopped feeling any sense of real risk in combat with my rouge PC. In fact started taking more risks with little or no consequence as my actions during play bore out.

That being said a lot of these guys that say "But I have PC's die all the time!" or whatever - there is a total lack of context.

Do the PC's rush pell-mell into every encounter with no tactics? Does the GM look at an encounter in a module and go "Too easy!" And turn up the dial as a matter of routine? Who knows.

At the very least when 5e is concerned it is not controversial to note that its design intent is inherently forgiving to PC's. A tacit acknowledgement of this is that the alternate rules in the DMG revolve wholly around making 5e harder for the PC's in terms of rests, wounds etc. Not easier.

I don't disagree with this, although implementing something like a simple death flag is no major hack to D&D.

5e has 3 death flags w/ its death saves. And very forgiving healing mechanics. How much more is needed?

Even then you are basically correct. A simple homebrew hack or two is not the end of the world for sure.

However, in my opinion, if a GM finds themselves consistently having to modify the system to get what they want, then they would be better off going to a different system that better serves their needs from the jump.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

If they are a group that runs things pretty much straight up I can believe them.

I guess... as long as you never hit an unlucky streak.

I run high power games (lots of items cool inate abilities PCs learn like magic items, higher stats) and I find my players hit way above there weight class (they should see above) but even still I have come close to TPK with 'easy' encounters if a player does something dumb or gets a string of bad rolls or if the monsters get good ones (god forbid all three happen that IS a TPK)

When my group did Waterdeep heist the GM ran it as intended and at about 5th level I stopped feeling any sense of real risk in combat with my rouge PC. I in fact started taking more risks with little or consequence as my actions during play bore out.

I don't know waterdeep heist... but for mod/ out of box Curse of Strahd (both with and without running death house that is a meatgrinder) and Rime of the Frost Maiden has proven deadly to many groups.

That being said a lot of these guys that say "But I have PC's die all the time!" or whatever - there is a total lack of context.

I agree I try to give context when ever I claim that it can be deadly (if anything maybe I give too much info)

At the very least when 5e is concerned it is not controversial to note that its design intent is inherently forgiving to PC's. A tacit acknowledgement of this is that the alternate rules in the DMG revolve wholly around making 5e harder for the PC's in terms of rests, wounds etc. Not easier.

compaired to 2e and prior 5e is a dream that no one can die in... compared to 3e it is less lethal but not a ton (a noticable amount though) I think it is slightly more deadly then 4e but so slight it almost isn't noticable... however it is still on the deadlier end of the scale of role playing games I have played (and way less lethal then WoD or CoC)

5e has 3 death flags w/ its death saves. And very forgiving healing mechanics. How much more is needed?

I mean if I drop you to 0 and an AOE hits you, that also gives a auto failed death save...

I don't know if it is 100% RAI but as I understand RAW, if mymulti attack opens with a crit, I drop you then I hit you again it is also a failed death save...

so 1,2,or 3 50/50 rolls later you can be dead... and at lowlevel a fireball can kill you...

a 4th level wildmage rolling (not my story but I don't doubt it) the fireball effect and getting 8d6 and was at less then 20 hp so died out right...and the rogue was down in the AOE already having failed a death save... so he died outeight and she died the next round.

my most resent PC death happened when I (wizard) and the Cleric were both making death saves... a party member stabilized the cleric figureing I only had 1 failure and 2 successes but I rolled a nat 1 and auto died.

 

[TwoSix]

5e has 3 death flags w/ its death saves. And very forgiving healing mechanics. How much more is needed?

Even then you are basically correct. A simple homebrew hack or two is not the end of the world for sure.

However, in my opinion, if a GM finds themselves consistently having to modify the system to get what they want, then they would be better off going to a different system that better serves their needs from the jump.

A "death flag", as I've normally seen the term, is that the PC can't be killed (they can suffer and lose, but not die to a random roll) unless the player explicitly says the character is willing to die due to the importance of a particular scene, and gain benefits for the scene due to the risk.

 

[Jaeger]

as long as you never hit an unlucky streak.

I run high power games (lots of items cool inate abilities PCs learn like magic items, higher stats) and I find my players hit way above there weight class (they should see above) but even still I have come close to TPK with 'easy' encounters if a player does something dumb or gets a string of bad rolls or if the monsters get good ones (god forbid all three happen that IS a TPK)

Unlucky streaks do happen. I have had that as a player and a GM. It makes for interesting gaming. People go on streaks IRL, so I find it emulative.

Not a problem.

I mean if I drop you to 0 and an AOE hits you, that also gives a auto failed death save...

I don't know if it is 100% RAI but as I understand RAW, if my multi attack opens with a crit, I drop you then I hit you again it is also a failed death save...

so 1,2,or 3 50/50 rolls later you can be dead... and at low level a fireball can kill you...

a 4th level wildmage rolling (not my story but I don't doubt it) the fireball effect and getting 8d6 and was at less then 20 hp so died out right...and the rogue was down in the AOE already having failed a death save... so he died outright and she died the next round.

my most resent PC death happened when I (wizard) and the Cleric were both making death saves... a party member stabilized the cleric figuring I only had 1 failure and 2 successes but I rolled a nat 1 and auto died.

I don't see the problem here.

These are all potential consequences of running the game as intended. It is what makes the in-game stakes lively and gives PC's real sense of accomplishment when they overcome challenges.

If the players say that they want to play 5e, but don't want the possibilities of PC death that you outlined above, then they really don't want to play 5e.

They want to play a game with a "D&D" veneer, but with a much different rules system.

A "death flag", as I've normally seen the term, is that the PC can't be killed (they can suffer and lose, but not die to a random roll) unless the player explicitly says the character is willing to die due to the importance of a particular scene, and gain benefits for the scene due to the risk.

Well, that is shifting things to a completely different gaming paradigm.

The die mechanic is now completely removed as a neutral randomizer to resolve in-game actions.

You can house rule a system - adjusting the dial up and down a few places to better tune in to what you want to do at the table. The optional rules in the 5e DMG do this.

But there is a fundamental difference between a 'house rule' that adjusts system mechanics in a predictable fashion - and one that says: At this point we ignore the mechanical system entirely, because 'story'.

Why fight the system (By introducing a 'rule' that short-circuits it entirely) if your play expectations differ so drastically from the intended play paradigm of the RPG you are using?

Why not use a game that incorporates these aspect from the get go?

A more purpose designed RPG where impromptu lethality is largely removed, or a straight up Storygame would far better serve the needs of the table if complete narrative control of in-game outcomes is desired by the gaming group.

 

[Azzy]

Why fight the system (By introducing a 'rule' that short-circuits it entirely) if your play expectations differ so drastically from the intended play paradigm of the RPG you are using?

Why not use a game that incorporates these aspect from the get go?

The same could be asked of those that want a deadlier game?

 

[GMforPowergamers]

I don't see the problem here.

These are all potential consequences of running the game as intended. It is what makes the in-game stakes lively and gives PC's real sense of accomplishment when they overcome challenges.

If the players say that they want to play 5e, but don't want the possibilities of PC death that you outlined above, then they really don't want to play 5e.

They want to play a game with a "D&D" veneer, but with a much different rules system.

I mean it ISN'T a problem... however it isn;t like death can't happen

 

[Arilyn]

The same could be asked of those that want a deadlier game?

Exactly. D&D on "hard mode" is more than acceptable but people reducing lethality are often told they'd be happier playing something else. But D&D is suppose to be open to house ruling. 3rd party publishers play around with it all the time giving us AiME, Pugmire, Beowulf, to name just a few.