D&D 5E Larger bonus to damage for weapons and damage reduction for armor instead of attack and AC bonus?

[Olrox17]

I had thought about armor as HP but hadn't figured out how to reconcile healing. Aside from having two damage tracks like in Shadowrun.

Temporary hit points solve this. They can't be healed.

 

[Sleepy Walker]

I had thought about armor as HP but hadn't figured out how to reconcile healing. Aside from having two damage tracks like in Shadowrun.

This is actually what I will be doing for my campaign, though for all base armor. For it to nicely work out you need to split into two damage pools (mine is health and stamina) or figure out some way to have it count as temporary HP or something similar.

What is nice is that with regards to actual play speed, there is no appreciable change.
What is no nice is that it touches upon a lot of things, including any spell which takes into account total HP, resting/repairing, and others that escape my mind right now.

Armor: Temporary HP at end of long rest, to an amount which scales on magical power. Could work so long as temporary HP does not count towards spells like Sleep or Power Word: XXXX

Edit: Ohh, you were saying you were thinking about armor as just HP. Yes, that is a bit more tricky. Having a combination of factors is easier to fine-tune and take into account factors which may break the system. I personally think a combination of AC and fine-tuned health bonuses provide a better system.

 

[Krachek]

There is a lot of talk about breaking bounded accuracy with +1/+2/+3 weapons and armor/shields. Especially the armor part.

So instad of +1/+2/+3 to attack and damage weapons would gain +1d6/+2d6/+3d6 on damage.

Why die/dice instead of larger flat bonus?

Dice adds to critical damage and rolling more dice on critical is more fun. And critical should be critical.

Armor whould give 2/4/6 damage reduction instead of +1/+2/+3 AC bonus.

For shields I would not add any fixed bonuses, rather shields should have special enchantments removed from attack/damage/general damage reduction like fire resistance, evasion, etc.

Instead of bonus magical sword can effectively use +1d4 or +1d6 or +1d8 extra damage. It can replace +1 +2 and +3 weapon. A unconditional +3d6 damage seem OP.
It will help bound accuracy.

A magic armor with DR is already possible I think. But a DR3 will render useless very small damage like d4+1.
It will go against bound accuracy. Making low CR monster useless the same way as too high AC.
I think you should instead go for defensive properties.
Granting Temp HP. Additional healing surge, healing, avoid critical hits, negates advantage, etc..

 

[delericho]

A magic armor with DR is already possible I think.

Does DR even exist as a concept in the published 5e books? A scan of the magic items in the DMG and of the Barbarian class (the most likely to have it) doesn't turn anything up. The closest is resistance, which halves the damage taken, but that's not really the same.

But a DR3 will render useless very small damage like d4+1.

It renders them less effective, certainly, but a 1d4+1 can still hit a 5, which gets past DR3. And bear in mind that these are intended to replace the armours +X, which also significantly cut the average damage of very weak creatures.

Also worth noting that these are magic items of uncommon rarity or lower - by the time the PCs are likely to be getting them, you'd expect those very weak opponents to be significantly outclassed.

I think you should instead go for defensive properties.
Granting Temp HP. Additional healing surge, healing, avoid critical hits, negates advantage, etc..

All the above said, I do mostly agree with this - I'm generally inclined to remove the items +X in favour of what you describe.

 

[dave2008]

Does DR even exist as a concept in the published 5e books? A scan of the magic items in the DMG and of the Barbarian class (the most likely to have it) doesn't turn anything up. The closest is resistance, which halves the damage taken, but that's not really the same.

Yes. Heavy Armor Mastery: "While you are wearing heavy armor, bludgeoning, piercing, and slashing damage that you take from non-magical weapons is reduced by 3."

 

[delericho]

Yes. Heavy Armor Mastery: "While you are wearing heavy armor, bludgeoning, piercing, and slashing damage that you take from non-magical weapons is reduced by 3."

Thanks!

 

[Gadget]

I think the idea has a lot of merit. For those people saying it is "Not D&D", the OP is not talking about replacing AC with Damage reduction, just the magical + of armors and weapons, which is much more reasonable. Besides, D&D already has this feature in various places: Heavy Armor Master feat, and the Abjurer Wizard's Arcane Ward (though this functions more like temporary Hit Points than Damage Resistance) come to mind off hand. I've always been a big fan of de-emphasizing the 'plus' part of weapons & armor and focusing more on other features that can make the item cool and fun to have without going overboard on the 'arms race' of ever increasing bonuses. 5e has already reduced the range form +1-5 to +1-3, so it is not without precedent.

That having been said, one concern I share with [MENTION=6801397]Olrox17[/MENTION] is that the values of damage reduction could get out of hand, especially if you have things like Heavy Armor Master and such in play. It makes mook attacks, already less likely to hit, almost pointless if the damage is mostly negated. Maybe only the values of +1, +2, +3 for damage reduction? It does not sound like much, but taking 1 to 3 points of damage away from every hit really adds up over time. You could go with temporary hit points that replenishes every long rest, but this sounds like more book keeping and would be hard to get the numbers right.

 

[The Crimson Binome]

Critical hits have always been a bad rule. Weapons should be dangerous without relying on a gimmicky 5% chance to do something meaningful.

 

[Satyrn]

There is a lot of talk about breaking bounded accuracy with +1/+2/+3 weapons and armor/shields. Especially the armor part.

So instad of +1/+2/+3 to attack and damage weapons would gain +1d6/+2d6/+3d6 on damage.

Why die/dice instead of larger flat bonus?

Dice adds to critical damage and rolling more dice on critical is more fun. And critical should be critical.

Armor whould give 2/4/6 damage reduction instead of +1/+2/+3 AC bonus.

For shields I would not add any fixed bonuses, rather shields should have special enchantments removed from attack/damage/general damage reduction like fire resistance, evasion, etc.

When I'm, DMing, all of the weapons and armor I hand out are more like your shields, but far broader than what you suggest. Like, "Assassin's Armor" that lets its wielder slip into the shadowfell, say, or a "sword of Pelor" that lets the wielder turn undead and cast daylight.

 

[Blue]

There is a lot of talk about breaking bounded accuracy with +1/+2/+3 weapons and armor/shields. Especially the armor part.

So instad of +1/+2/+3 to attack and damage weapons would gain +1d6/+2d6/+3d6 on damage.

Why die/dice instead of larger flat bonus?

Dice adds to critical damage and rolling more dice on critical is more fun. And critical should be critical.

Armor whould give 2/4/6 damage reduction instead of +1/+2/+3 AC bonus.

For shields I would not add any fixed bonuses, rather shields should have special enchantments removed from attack/damage/general damage reduction like fire resistance, evasion, etc.

I am not against this. There's a few points I'd want to consider - not for or against, but how they change the feel.

For armor: Because of such a wide variation in damage dealt, this at times can make you feel like a king (lots of small attacks coming at you) and at times it's not noticeable (single, large attacks). It's clean enough that it shouldn't slow down play, but it's got such variation.

For weapons: Weapon wielders are already the sustained damage dealing kings, this cements them there. (BUT, no one is sayign that casters are lagging behind right now, so I could accept that.) It make extra attack more important, as well bonus action attacks that use the same weapon such as Polearm Mastery (or GMW and a crit). On the other hand, since it's a separate weapon it yet again leaves dual wielding in the dust. My only concern is that two otherwise equal weapon wielders may make a huge difference, and then the one with the magic weapon becomes the buff target of those party-cast concentration spells and the divide becomes even more. But that's true no matter what, so maybe it's not a big deal.