Unearthed Arcana Latest Unearthed Arcana Introduces Rogue & Ranger Archetypes

New UA (1/16/2017): Ranger and Rogue

The new UA is up, you can see it here:http://media.wizards.com/2016/dnd/downloads/2017_01_UA_RangerRogue_0117JCMM.pdf

 

[Leatherhead]

It is significantly restrained compared to Second Wind because of when you can trigger it.

This is not so. The fact that the ability also buffs your hit point total more than makes up for that.

 

[The_Hanged_Man]

Given that Piercing Thorns is on level with Colossus Slayer, the addition of Guardian Soul on top of that is too much power creep for my tastes. While in tree form the ranger could use also large weapons too, so Piercing Thorns could be dropped all together. Plus, Ancient Fortitude and Guardian Aura seem stronger than Defensive Tactics or Superior Hunter's Defense so some balancing is in order.

Some suggestions:
Lvl 3 - Drop Piercing Thorns (or Disallow Large Weapons). Maybe even make the transformation a full action, but perhaps that is going too far.
Lvl 7- Ancient Fortitude only once per short or long rest.
Lvl 11- No Change
Lvl 15 - Guardian Aura does not work on 0 HP. Otherwise the whack-a-mole is real.

Even with all those changes I think it is still probably stronger than Hunter though.

 

[bganon]

I think the Large size just leads to all sorts of problems. I'd drop it and replace with something like "no enemies may move through your space" since that seems in line with the general theme.

WOTC already quietly added "once per rest" to Ancient Fortitude in the download at some point.

 

[Kobold Stew]

The Horizon Walker was always, for me, such an evocative prestige class in 3.5. I loved the idea of terrain mastery, with a character eventually comfortable with inter planar travel.

The idea was better than the execution, though -- I wanted a character that could facilitate plane-hopping adventures. The level 7 Plane Shift spell does that (in one of its uses) -- an ability that typically comes for spellcasters at level 13.

What I'd like to see here, as the level 11 ability, would be replace Distant Strike with the ability to cast, 1/long rest, a Plane shift spell on willing creatures. (and so excluding the attack vs. unwilling creatures option), and not requiring the material component.

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

The power the person I was responding to was Ancient Fortitude, and they were talking about entering and leaving guardian form to heal 2*level HPs each time. That's been changed to once per rest (short or long).

I don't see it. From the same PDF:

Ancient Fortitude
At 7th level, you gain the endurance of the
ancient forests. Your hit point maximum and
current hit points increase by 2 per ranger level
when you assume your guardian form. This
increase lasts until you leave the form; your hit
point maximum then returns to normal, but your
current hit points remain the same, unless they
must decrease to abide by your hit point
maximum.

Still no mention of rests.

 

[Sorcerers Apprentice]

The Horizon Walker was always, for me, such an evocative prestige class in 3.5. I loved the idea of terrain mastery, with a character eventually comfortable with inter planar travel.

The idea was better than the execution, though -- I wanted a character that could facilitate plane-hopping adventures. The level 7 Plane Shift spell does that (in one of its uses) -- an ability that typically comes for spellcasters at level 13.

What I'd like to see here, as the level 11 ability, would be replace Distant Strike with the ability to cast, 1/long rest, a Plane shift spell on willing creatures. (and so excluding the attack vs. unwilling creatures option), and not requiring the material component.

Replace a strong combat boost in line with what other classes get at lvl 11 with something that's essentially a ribbon?

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

I think the Large size just leads to all sorts of problems. I'd drop it and replace with something like "no enemies may move through your space" since that seems in line with the general theme.

It's ironic to see everyone objecting to Large size on this thread as extremely powerful, when in the general case, if you comment on how e.g. Mounted Combatant is a very strong feat, so many people will turn right around and tell you that you can't get Large-sized mounts into adventuring locations like dungeons and that Mounted Combatant is therefore useless. Both of these things cannot be true simultaneously.

I'm not saying it's the same people speaking up in both cases BTW, just that it's interesting to see.

Speaking for myself, I'm fine with Large PCs. It has advantages (larger weapons) and disadvantages (harder to get cover; penalties from fighting in smaller spaces), plus the intrinsic disadvantages of being a ranger instead of a fighter (fewer attacks) and the Guardian form itself (low mobility).

But then, I grew up with 2nd edition Dark Sun, so half-giants aren't a new thing for me.

 

[Kobold Stew]

Replace a strong combat boost in line with what other classes get at lvl 11 with something that's essentially a ribbon?

I don't see it as a ribbon -- I see it (in ye olde terms) as shifting from the combat pillar to the exploration pillar. Blinking 10' is simply a combat bonus -- it doesn't tie to the idea of plane-hopping/knowing. Plane-shifting is an ability that is key to the character premise; the other is a combat boost.

I don't mind my proposal being beefed up, but I'm saying that I don't need it to be. This isn't a horizon walker I'd want to play, but one change takes it there.

 

[Sorcerers Apprentice]

I don't see it as a ribbon -- I see it (in ye olde terms) as shifting from the combat pillar to the exploration pillar. Blinking 10' is simply a combat bonus -- it doesn't tie to the idea of plane-hopping/knowing. Plane-shifting is an ability that is key to the character premise; the other is a combat boost.

I don't mind my proposal being beefed up, but I'm saying that I don't need it to be. This isn't a horizon walker I'd want to play, but one change takes it there.

The reason I call it a ribbon is because it doesn't add much in the way of problem-solving ability. Being able to plane shift once a day is mostly a flavour ability that may come in useful every once in a while, that's a typical ribbon ability. Why is something som monumental as being able to shift between planes a "flavour" ability? If the DM is running planes-hopping adventures then he will neccessarily have to provide the characters with means to travel between planes. If you're not playing planes-hopping adventures then the ability to plane-hop will rarely be directly useful.

 

[Kobold Stew]

I accept that. It's still a character I would want to play, whereas this Horizon Walker is not.

I also suspect that over the years I have been one of the more vocal fans of the Horizon-Walker concept -- I'd happily give up lots to have a cool plane-hopper even if it's not great for every campaign.