Survey (A5E) Level Up Survey #1: Broad Outlines

[hawkeyefan]

That would definitely not be 5e compatible then.

Yeah, I know it’s not gonna happen. And that’s fine! I think the stated goal of 5E but crunchier is worthwhile and compatibility with 5E is a good idea for several reasons.

For me, though, I think my main issue with D&D....or maybe the root cause of several issues....is the HP system. The 5 minute work day, the need for a healing class, the hundred foot fall that barely phases a PC, the absolute slog that combat can be....all these things and more would very likely go away without hit point mechanics.

And I think there potentially could be a way to do so and still be 5E....but it would be more a revision of the game rather than simply an addition of elements to create a more mechanically involved game. So yeah....I don’t see it happening with this project.

 

[LuisCarlos17f]

I would like something like (ki power souce) maneuvers like the ones from "Tome of Battle: Book of the Nine Swords", in the middle step between at-will and once-encounter powers (some maneuvers wouldn't be ki but arcane, primal or divine magic).

 

[jeffh]

I don’t want to derail the thread with stuff that’s not gonna happen, but I’d happily ditch hit points entirely.

Something that I said in response to the survey that may be possible, or at least more likely, would be to craft social mechanics that are as meaningful and engaging as combat.

Never going to be a fan of suggestions for "improving" D&D that are basically "make it not recognizable as D&D anymore", especially in a context like this. There are lots of other games out there that give very different experiences, it's likely you're better off trying one of them than trying to ram the square peg of D&D into the round hole you want to fit it into.

 

[dave2008]

I don’t want to derail the thread with stuff that’s not gonna happen, but I’d happily ditch hit points entirely.

Ya, that would feel like a different game to me. I am all for adding a distinction to HP (similar to bloodied HP which I did suggest), but getting rid of them all together - no thank you.

Something that I said in response to the survey that may be possible, or at least more likely, would be to craft social mechanics that are as meaningful and engaging as combat.

Yes, that seems to be in the same vein as stronghold rules.

 

[dave2008]

For me, though, I think my main issue with D&D....or maybe the root cause of several issues....is the HP system. The 5 minute work day, the need for a healing class, the hundred foot fall that barely phases a PC, the absolute slog that combat can be....all these things and more would very likely go away without hit point mechanics.

I am sure there are issues that can't be solved, but all of the ones you have listed can be solved within the HP system (and fairly easily IMO). For the way we play I feel we have already done it, but everyone wants something different.

 

[hawkeyefan]

I am sure there are issues that can't be solves, but all of the ones you have listed can be solved within the HP system (and fairly easily IMO). For the way we play I feel we have already done it, but everyone wants something different.

Yeah, for sure. And I get that Level Up is meant to be very much D&D, so I think HP are pretty much a given.

And some of those concerns can possibly be solved while still keeping HP.

I think I just prefer a game where HP don’t accumulate to the levels they do in 5E, which makes the game kind of a slog at times and can make things that are meant to be or should be challenging or dangerous not so.

Having said that though, I’m not even sure what I’d replace HP with if it were up to me! And the compatibility goal for Level Up means that HP are pretty much a given. Which is probably for the best, despite my personal preference.

 

[hawkeyefan]

Never going to be a fan of suggestions for "improving" D&D that are basically "make it not recognizable as D&D anymore", especially in a context like this. There are lots of other games out there that give very different experiences, it's likely you're better off trying one of them than trying to ram the square peg of D&D into the round hole you want to fit it into.

Yeah, I get it. I don’t know if some alternative to HP couldn’t be implemented that would still leave D&D feeling like D&D, but I understand. I play several games that function that way, and for me, that’s one of the clear advantages that they have over D&D. Hence my preference.

But I get that the goal of this is not to change things about the game so much as add to it.

 

[dave2008]

I think I just prefer a game where HP don’t accumulate to the levels they do in 5E, which makes the game kind of a slog at times and can make things that are meant to be or should be challenging or dangerous not so.

Hmm, that is not a problem I have, but everyone plays differently. However, I do understanding wanting to retreat from the HP and damage inflation. I have thought about limiting HP after 10th lvl based on HD to (no Con mod after 10th either):
d6 = 1HP / lvl
d8 = 2HP / lvl
d10 = 3HP / lvl
d12 = 4HP / lvl

IMO, it doesn't really change the PCs, but It makes the higher CR monsters more dangerous longer which I like.

 

[jeffh]

Yeah, I get it. I don’t know if some alternative to HP couldn’t be implemented that would still leave D&D feeling like D&D,

In fairness to you, True20, whose best-known implementation is Mutants & Masterminds, attempted this. How well it worked is a matter of some controversy, both online and among people I personally know who've tried it. There definitely do exist people who like it, not sure in what proportion. I don't really have a view on that topic myself except to say that it would be enough of a change to make it not-D&D for me, personally. (Not necessarily a criticism, but enough to put it outside the scope of this thread.)

 

[JonM]

Just finished the survey. Just seeing the nature of the questions asked, etc., is giving me a good feeling about this.