Pathfinder 2E Looks like I will be running a PF2e game in a few weeks...suggestions?

[Thomas Shey]

To agree but reframe less harshly, its ok to have things to learn how to do or finesse.

And when people don't essentially blame the designers of a game for the fact they aren't in sync with that design, I do. If someone says "I can't seem to run the game the way the designers expect me to" I'll nod my head and say "That's always going to be a problem with strongly designed (as in, designs trying for a particular kind of effect) game systems; they're going to work really well for some people and not well for others".

(This is besides the issue that as noted, the first two PF2e APs were, as per usual, fighting the last war with the usual problems that creates. But I'm playing in Age of Ashes, so I know it can still be done, even if a couple of places are pretty rough).

Ive been GMing a decade, and recently paged through the basics-of-basic GMing techniques presented in the GMG and was embarrassed to realize I need a back to basics revitalization of my moment to moment techniques-- evocative descriptions and the like, theyve definetly withered over time as i havent been paying attention.

Absolutely a thing; I suffer from it seriously (arguably never really been my strong suit, which is setting design and NPC depiction in play). Of course in my case I'm also an old fart and probably a bit set in my ways.

 

[Thomas Shey]

In my defense, one of my three TPKs in Age of Ashes was due to an honest mistake that any logical person could've made and that a system should've been able to handle and wasn't explicitly called out in the adventure design. The rest I'm chalking up to the writers not knowing what they were doing in the first AP.

And that is entirely fair. The thing I've said in multiple places is that designers in the D&D sphere tend to write the first few adventures as though they were doing it for the prior edition. The only time that can work is if the changes between editions are very minimal. Age of Ashes isn't the only example of that, but it absolutely is an example of that.

The current AP I'm running (Abomination Vaults) I'm not having a problem with. I did come in this thread originally to provide some advice for the OP in how to prepare it better. As for how I'm running it, I've followed the advice in the adventure. I didn't add optional stuff that is outside the presented adventure, which could've added a single role-playing encounter to the adventure's opening.
I think my criticisms of the AP are all valid from my perspective. It's still the best I've seen from Paizo for this edition.
Do I love PF2? No, it's not my favorite system, but it is ok. I'd probably like it better if I was running my own content.

Here's a case where I'll mention something I've never done in prior discussions: I kind of hate published adventures in general. They always seem overly rigid in how you need to work your way through them. Its foreign to my natural tendency to manage things that tightly, though some of it is inevitable in games that make an attempt to balance encounters (because doing them on the fly is possible but at least annoying), as it is in Fragged Empire right now.

But almost all adventures are, perhaps not on rails, but at least dependent on the street network.

 

[GreyLord]

So, I now have the volumes of Abomination Vault AP. As per the thread it appears I should start reading through it and prepping so I can run it soon.

 

[FrozenNorth]

But yes, I'll proudly take the fall here for my group, since I'm the GM. And I can say that if I can't run a PF2 Adventure Path "properly" then to hell with Paizo's Ivory Tower design.

I don’t think you should take the fall alone here. I freely admit that as a player, what I have to go on is what you’ve presented and the Otari player’s handbook, but while the handbook sketched out some inhabitants of Otari, it didn’t really tie them into the dungeon very much.

There’s Wrin, who only seems concerned by the light above the dungeon. There was another character that hates wolves because his wife was killed by one, but wolves aren’t really noted dungeon dwellers.

My impression, as a player, was that there were NPCs presented who had hooks, but those hooks weren’t really tied to the dungeon we were supposed to be exploring.

Also, as a mentioned in a previous post, I was turned off by: this is a good-sized town with several adventurers and retired adventurers, and there just happens to be a mega-dungeon 15 min walk away that no one has explored.

 

[CapnZapp]

My impression, as a player, was that there were NPCs presented who had hooks, but those hooks weren’t really tied to the dungeon we were supposed to be exploring.

I hope this doesn't come as a surprise or spoiler, but they are.

Also, as a mentioned in a previous post, I was turned off by: this is a good-sized town with several adventurers and retired adventurers, and there just happens to be a mega-dungeon 15 min walk away that no one has explored.

Sorry but this is supposed to be a beginner-friendly dungeon. The proximity to safety is definitely meant as a bonus, not a drawback.

I am afraid I must say this continues the theme where you argue as if completely unawares of what a D&D dungeon is and isn't...

Change things up so it's a two-day trek through dangerous swamp terrain if you feel this makes things better (with Wrin accompanying the fledgling heroes during the first few levels; she can't bring herself to enter due to her claustrophobia) - an easy fix that changes little.

(A few things do change but not much)

 

[FrozenNorth]

Sorry but this is supposed to be a beginner-friendly dungeon. The proximity to safety is definitely meant as a bonus, not a drawback.

It is possible to achieve the goal “a beginner-friendly adventure where safety isn’t too far” without requiring suspension of disbelief “yeah, we have a huge dungeon just a short stroll from a medium-sized town that caters to adventurers. No, it hasn’t been explored. Why not? Never got around to it.”

Change things up so it's a two-day trek through dangerous swamp terrain if you feel this makes things better (with Wrin accompanying the fledgling heroes during the first few levels; she can't bring herself to enter due to her claustrophobia) - an easy fix that changes little.

Once again, I’m not the DM.

 

[CapnZapp]

I guess I just have seen this discussion and its complaints against a given dungeon a thousand times before.

Yes, a dungeon could be just as meticulously crafted, with complex stories and NPCs, as other adventures. But that won't happen, since a dungeon by its very nature is a simplified concept most good interested-in-more-complex-themes scenario writers won't touch with a ten-foot pole.

So perhaps it's time to accept that a dungeon is what it is, and consider Abomination Vaults a pretty decent entry in the field...?

(I'm not defending the adventure path, I'm saying that for being a dungeon, this one isn't half bad, and that if you do think it is half bad, which it very might well be overall, you might want to consider broaden your horizon and look for other adventure structures.)

Edit: replaced "good" with a more specific and less value-laden adjective

 

[GreyLord]

Started helping create characters for this and reading the BBox DM rules. I was confused on Experience.

It's wording is a little odd. It sounds as if you give the entire party the entire amount that is listed on the table, so if the table lists 40 XP for the encounter, than each member of the party will get 40 XP? That means that what is listed on the table it is not split between 4 members for a total of 10 XP each, but instead each member gets 40 XP each?

 

[Thomas Shey]

I don't have the boxed version, but that's true with the main rules for a party of four.

 

[Thomas Shey]

I don't have the boxed version, but that's true with the main rules for a party of four.

Just realized I didn't elaborate on this the way I wanted to. The main corebook has a whole section after this discussing what to do with larger or smaller parties (which as I recall adds up to "prorate").