Lord Voldemort

painandgreed

First Post
He was a special form of lich (edit, not lich because he was never a dead body. Suffice to just say he had performed a special ritual.) that created multiple phylactories before death. After death, they keep the creator's soul on the prime material as a incoporial being with the power to possess other creatures or even constructs (edit, this would be some sort of named undead, special to the ritual that allowed it), and can be returned to life with a special 4th level arcane spell.

He was also a specialist which was incapable of understanding at least one sphere of magic which was his constant downfall. Or just evil and incapable of understanding the benefits of good, even the small amounts that his evil follows still had such as caring for family. It was his inability to understand this small bit of magic that caused him to fail every time. Also keep in mind that harry was the PC, and the PC almost always wins.
 

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Eeralai

First Post
painandgreed said:
He was a special form of lich (edit, not lich because he was never a dead body. Suffice to just say he had performed a special ritual.) that created multiple phylactories before death. After death, they keep the creator's soul on the prime material as a incoporial being with the power to possess other creatures or even constructs (edit, this would be some sort of named undead, special to the ritual that allowed it), and can be returned to life with a special 4th level arcane spell.

He was also a specialist which was incapable of understanding at least one sphere of magic which was his constant downfall. Or just evil and incapable of understanding the benefits of good, even the small amounts that his evil follows still had such as caring for family. It was his inability to understand this small bit of magic that caused him to fail every time. Also keep in mind that harry was the PC, and the PC almost always wins.


I like your analysis. I also like throwing the Yanti blood into the mix. A lot of people have put him at a much higher level than I would. A lot of his power, I think, is derived from his willingness to use the unforgivable curses all the time and the good guys reluctance to use them. I love the series, but come on. If I had been Harry's mother, I would've avada kadava'd the big V's butt rather than wait for V to do it to me. I realize the series is all about making grand sacrifices, but sometimes a good butt kicking is what is called for instead :)

Thanks for all the responses. They have been fun reading.
 

SteelDraco

First Post
Eeralai said:
A lot of people have put him at a much higher level than I would. A lot of his power, I think, is derived from his willingness to use the unforgivable curses all the time and the good guys reluctance to use them. I love the series, but come on. If I had been Harry's mother, I would've avada kadava'd the big V's butt rather than wait for V to do it to me. I realize the series is all about making grand sacrifices, but sometimes a good butt kicking is what is called for instead :)

Thanks for all the responses. They have been fun reading.
The reason I pegged him around 20th level was simply because he's described routinely as the most powerful wizard in the world - or second to Dumbledore. To me, that suggests 20th level. If people in your view of the setting top out at lower level, then he'll be at or near that top level.
 

Obrysii

First Post
The trick to Harry Potter, at least as far as I have read and seen, is that most spells are low level and utility -- many can be described as 0th and 1st level spells. Only a rare few exceed 4th level in power, and only the top-dogs of the wizarding world can really do them.

So the average "wizard" is a sorceror with tons of spells known and TONS of spell-slots ... like a Duskblade, really, in terms of capacity of spells-per-day.

And the average post-education "wizard" is at most 5th level, with the upper limits being ~10ish. It's a very eberronish world, really, where low level magics are the most important portions of the infrastructure of the world.
 

painandgreed

First Post
Eeralai said:
I like your analysis. I also like throwing the Yanti blood into the mix. A lot of people have put him at a much higher level than I would. A lot of his power, I think, is derived from his willingness to use the unforgivable curses all the time and the good guys reluctance to use them. I love the series, but come on. If I had been Harry's mother, I would've avada kadava'd the big V's butt rather than wait for V to do it to me. I realize the series is all about making grand sacrifices, but sometimes a good butt kicking is what is called for instead :)

Thanks for all the responses. They have been fun reading.

About the extra blood. I think that would come in with the extra phylactories. As part of the 4th level spell that would return the spirit to life, some of the phylactories must be used or there is otherwise a connection, and one gains a suitable template. Or perhaps living things are easier to turn into such phylactories, and in those cases, blood is required and template is aquired. Or the spell brings you back to life but you are still horribly scarred as the necromatic creature you are.

Just because somebody could say 'avada kadava' doesn't mean they can cast the spell. They would have to have the knowledge how to do it and then the will and desire to do so. Thus to be effective, his mother would have to have wanted to kill Voldemorte more than save her son. Being a good person not prone to murderous rages or pratice in the dark arts, her curse probably would have failed anyway. Also, despite his downfall, you-know-who was always presented as a supurb wizard. Very powerful and very skilled. She probably wasn't up to his level even in a fair fight. This is one of the reasons why Lord V could be defeated by harry. Nobody, including V, ever thought that Harry was of equal skill, and he wasn't. He always seemed to win by sheer circumstance or luck. The thing is, and I only think Dumbledore had figured it out, that nature, especially a magical nature, has a way of making 'luck' fulfill it's place. It was 'luck' that Harry's mother died in a manner that would protect him from V. It was 'luck' that Harry would end up with the twin of V's wand. It was 'luck' that harry would defeat Draco and be the wand's true owner. It was 'luck' that Harry would be willing to give his life and therefore survive the curse. Face it, somebody upstairs didn't like Lord Voldemort and had rigged all the cards before the game was even played, because V didn't understand the more advanced rules of magic.

...or something like that anyway, IMHO.
 

Capellan

Explorer
Lurks-no-More said:
One of the points Dumbledore makes in the books is that if Voldemort was the sort of man who didn't make the mistakes he did (entangling himself into the prophecy etc.), he wouldn't be trying to live forever and kill and intimidate Muggle-born and half-blood wizards.

When a writer includes a line that amounts to "my bad guy needs to be inept because otherwise my plot won't hold together", that's not a solution to the problem, it's a sign of it.
 

Lurks-no-More

First Post
Capellan said:
When a writer includes a line that amounts to "my bad guy needs to be inept because otherwise my plot won't hold together", that's not a solution to the problem, it's a sign of it.
But if the point of your story is that selfish, amoral evil will hollow itself out, that the fear of a thing can be worse than the thing itself, and that it's our choices and connections to other people that define and sustain us, it is not a problem if your selfish, amoral, evil villain, who inflicts a fate worse than death on himself because of his fear of death, and who severs himself from the humanity because of his arrogance and willingness to commit inhuman acts, is brought low by those traits.
 

AnonymousOne

First Post
airwalkrr said:
If forced to describe him in D&D terms (and I would be reluctant to do so), I would describe Voldemort as an epic-level sorcerer somewhere between 25th and 30th. He would have human racial traits, but he would also have a number of unique abilities that would justify raising his CR by 2 or 3. Overall I picture him as CR 28 or 29.

wow ... old thread.

Anyway I have a serious problem with this bolded portion. The greater Devils in the Nine Hells of the Fiendish codex are around CR 21 You're trying to tell me that some sort of megalomaniac wizard is more powerful than the Lords of Hell? I think Asmodeus would kick his ass and leave him screaming for mercy. (But then again I think the majority of the HP characters are noting but sorcerers with tons of Luck feats. :p
 

Capellan

Explorer
Lurks-no-More said:
who severs himself from the humanity because of his arrogance and willingness to commit inhuman acts, is brought low by those traits.

It is a problem if you make him so inept that you destroy his credibility as a legitimate threat by the end of the 4th book of your 7-book series.
 

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