D&D 4E Mage hand in 4e: what's the deal?

[Felon]

Mage Hand + 10' Pole = No traps! I ran a game where the wizard did just this and I thought it quite fun.

Why did none of the traps account for mage hands and ten-foot poles as a factor? Seems like they'd just need more discriminating triggers than small amounts of pressure.

 

[Nightchilde-2]

I declare this thread to be awesome.

 

[Lizard]

I wonder if this will be the model for summoned creatures/other things; based on the 'economy of action' article, you will burn your actions to direct the summoned thing.

It does sort of fit the genre. "Go, my minion! Slay my foes!" In movies/novels, the Big Bad always watches while his pet giant snake fights the heroes; he doesn't keep raining fireballs on them.

 

[Dausuul]

3. To keep carrying the sunrod you need to walk up to where it is with your move, and then move it ahead. If using the mage hand to illuminate the path ahead it means the wizard is going to need to be pretty close to whatever he illuminates by the time the sunrod floats forward (assuming 40' shadowy is 8 spaces plus 5 spaces ahead is only 12-13 spaces). And, since the last action is to move the sunrod by necessity, by the time he sees the creature his actions will be over.

This is true by the rules, but it's an artifact of the game system and absolutely nonsensical in terms of the game world--the idea that you have to walk all the way up to your sunrod, then float it forward 30 feet, then walk up to it again, instead of just floating it steadily in front of you while walking at half speed, is ridiculous. Even if you argue that you have to stop walking and concentrate to move the rod, there's no reason you couldn't walk 5 feet, move the rod 5 feet, walk 5 feet, move the rod 5 feet, et cetera.

If a DM required my wizard to actually walk all the way up to the rod before floating it forward, I would respond by using the 1-1-1-1 movement system to prove that 1 equals the square root of 2 and therefore all of my character's stats should go up by 42%.

The logical way to address this is to say that you can spend a move action to move both yourself and your sunrod up to half your normal speed (so, if your speed is 6, you and your sunrod move 3 squares each).

 

[Lizard]

Why did none of the traps account for mage hands and ten-foot poles as a factor? Seems like they'd just need more discriminating triggers than small amounts of pressure.

Hong says not to think about things like that.

 

[Lizard]

This has three implications:
1. The wizard carrying a sunrod can't move in 'double time', but only one move per turn.
2. The wizard movement speed is likely reduced from 6 or 7 down to 5 over any period of multiple rounds, or he out paces his mage hand.
3. To keep carrying the sunrod you need to walk up to where it is with your move, and then move it ahead. If using the mage hand to illuminate the path ahead it means the wizard is going to need to be pretty close to whatever he illuminates by the time the sunrod floats forward (assuming 40' shadowy is 8 spaces plus 5 spaces ahead is only 12-13 spaces). And, since the last action is to move the sunrod by necessity, by the time he sees the creature his actions will be over.

All in all a very cool utility spell that I'm looking forward to seeing players use much more than prestidigitation ever was.

Remember, the physics of the world change when you're not in combat. I'd allow the mage to move the sunrod with him during non-encounter-mode. Only when in an encounter would I bother keeping track of nitpicky things like the above. This is also a good way to know when an encounter has begun.

"Hey, Magico the mage is walking funny!"
"Oh, great. We failed a spot check."

(And my players use PD all the frakin' time. Clean up clothes before meeting the Prince! Turn that boring gruel into tasty stew! Clean up the workroom! Alter hair color for a disguise! Change the familiar's litter box! I gave them a Glove Of Prestidigitation in D20 modern, and man, did they use it! Cleans up crime scenes but good...)

 

[eleran]

Hong says not to think about things like that.

Oh damn!! Its on like Donkey Hong now!!!

 

[Blue Monk]

A player character in my group was trapped in a pit trap by himself for an entire week. When ever a kobald was curious enough to peek into the pit he would use mage hand to pull it down into the pit! The consistant source of kobald kabobs kept him alive until a party of adventurers discovered his situation and rescued him!

 

[Dausuul]

I wonder if this will be the model for summoned creatures/other things; based on the 'economy of action' article, you will burn your actions to direct the summoned thing.

It does sort of fit the genre. "Go, my minion! Slay my foes!" In movies/novels, the Big Bad always watches while his pet giant snake fights the heroes; he doesn't keep raining fireballs on them.

I tend to view it as more of the evil wizard concentrating like hell on keeping the demon under his control, so it doesn't break free and eat him. (I really hope summoned creatures have the potential to get loose and eat their summoners, but they probably won't... WotC does not seem to be a fan of mechanics that can blow up in a PC's face.)

 

[drjones]

Sounds like the best way to deal with that is the small trip-wire spike trap followed a few feet later by the killer flaming blast trap that is triggered by 40lb of force on a pressure plate. I think they will be back to good old fashioned searching pretty fast.