Mages vs Clerics

[Nonlethal Force]

Set me up for the cleric. The ability to heal can overcome many unlucky rolls.

Spell for spell, there are combos that can go either way, so that is a tie.

Barring Polymorph, the cleric is far better when the spells run out.

All that leads me to think the cleric has the edge. But, I doubt it would get to the point of using more than three spels. Someone is going to roll unlickily. And that is really what that battle would be won or lost by. Who rolls unluckily first.

 

[mvincent]

the cleric is far better when the spells run out.

I can agree that a cleric is better off if both sides run out of spells.

I cannot imagine this ever happening to a wizard, but I do not disagree with your statement.

 

[Nail]

I vote for the cleric winning.

That said, it's clear it would all boil down to "who preps the best". Try this at 10th level -- now that would be *far* more interesting.

 

[evilbob]

I'm sorry but I have to back the wizard. Healing is a non-issue when the battle is over in a maximum of two rounds. Also "number of spells" is almost a moot point as well.

I also agree that it's probably a prep-vs.-prep issue, and that the initiative roll will most likely decide the outcome. That said, the wizard - as some have mentioned - has the advantage in range of spells and "location" spells (like teleport). "Fighting" (melee or ranged attacks) is just not something that's going to happen in a battle with a wizard, so a divine powered, strength buffed, etc. etc. cleric means nothing.

Clerics -do- have higher base saves and higher wisdom, so they certainly have a slight natural advantage against spells. However, arcane spells generally dwarf divine spells at pretty much every valence, so it's hard to see the divine caster coming out on top. The best strategy I can imagine for a cleric would be the antimagic route and trying to melee, but even then you've always got wish. (And a wizard can just plain outrun a cleric in heavy armor, so again: he'd just leave.)

As for "what would you do during a time stop:" gate, gate, teleport. Then scry the battle from the safety of your mansion while sipping tea. Seems safe to me. (Once again: a "duel" as some see it is assuming a wizard would ever be anywhere near a cleric, or if that happened, STAY near a cleric. I would seriously doubt the cleric would ever see the wizard, unless they had to be in visual range in order to begin.)

 

[werk]

I think the old adage is "It depends on who writes it."

Batman can easily whip up some kryptonite weapons and totally PWN superman.
Superman can burn Batman to a carbon smudge from space, then go backwards in time and watch himself do it.

It really depends on who you want to win...

 

[seans23]

Wizard - Time Stop
Cleric...dead.

Time Stop is a 9th level celerity domain spell.

 

[mvincent]

I think the old adage is "It depends on who writes it."

Batman can easily whip up some kryptonite weapons and totally PWN superman.
Superman can burn Batman to a carbon smudge from space, then go backwards in time and watch himself do it.

It really depends on who you want to win...

Certainly (in fact, I seem to recall Batman beating superman in the Dark Knight series). Nonetheless...

Wizards are like Superman.

Clerics are like Batman.

 

[evilbob]

Wizards are like Superman.

Clerics are like Batman.

Nice.

Succinct and to the point!

 

[Nail]

I'm sorry but I have to back the wizard.

Have you ever played a 20th level Clr in a long-term campaign? I have.

All three times we fought the Githyanki Lich Queen (Wiz 23, IIRC), my PC caused her death. All. Three. Times. (Darn phylactery.......)

Clerics are NOT going to beat Wizards every time. But Clrs sure can beat them often.....given prep.

As I said, it's all about the prep.

 

[glass]

I can agree that a cleric is better off if both sides run out of spells.

I cannot imagine this ever happening to a wizard, but I do not disagree with your statement.

If the wizard isn't going to run out of spells, then the cleric certainly isn't. All other things being equal, he had more...


glass.