D&D 5E Magic Item Creation in 5E

[Jeff Carlsen]

I didn't want my XP being used up to give them crap they wanted, but what I wanted. It adds up when doing wands, staves, and wondrous items.

We solved that problem by allowing the crafting wizard to drain XP from his allies when crafting for them. It had to be voluntary, though.

 

[Rampant]

Some ideas:

1. Magic items as character progression. - Now I don't mean the + system from 3 and 4 e where you had to get an armor enchant this high to play in the sand box with the rest of the party (i'm aware that + items were available before 3e, but not having played those I can't say much about them). I'm thinking that magic items could actually be improved by characters taking certain talent trees or whatever. For example a fighter finds a flaming sword that adds +x fire damage on each hit, and +y additional fire damage on a crit. This is your basic fire sword and probably the template for several weapon enchants (cold, acid, yadda yadda).

However next level the fighter decides to spend one of his talents or feats or whatever to kick it up a notch. By spending this talent for the Improved flame weapon ability he gets to unlock the next level in the item's description. This might increase the damage generated by the weapon, allow him to pierce or remove resistance/immunity, burn foes for lingering damage/effects, give a fire based magical ability, or any of a number of things.

If so desired the fighter can keep doing this until he is the undisputed master of flame weapons, but he sacrifices progress in other areas, on the plus side lots and lots of fire.

This works best if items either auto-level with their users, or no longer posses scaling power based on item level i.e. magic items are simply their enchantment, naturally occurring greater or lesser versions of the flame sword do not exist, all flaming weapons are flaming weapons and do not come in +2 flaming burst and +5 lesser flaming variations.

This makes crafting the basic weapon the important part, not constantly churning out the next higher +, and the difficulty/time involved can be scaled to match the DM and party interest since the character is paying for their fancier magic item powers out of their own character generation pool it makes it harder for items to throw the curve out of whack via being over or under abundant.

Furthermore this allows the character who is actually using the item to pay the cost rather than the crafter. This provides more excitement for the player and encourages them to stick with an item rather than heading down to the local Mordenkainen Mart. Also it means crafters don't get shafted, and the economy can make sense since making magic items doesn't always have to be a massive quest thing.

2. Auto leveling items. - I.e. the weapon becomes its more powerful variations based on whether the user leveled up. So the +1 flaming sword becomes the +2 flaming sword when the user reaches the appropriate level. This works best with 4e type items where the higher level versions scale the abilities as well as the basic +s.

This means that a player cannot somehow filch the BBEG's fancy magic sword o darkness and expect to get all the same benefits since the odds are the BBEG has a few levels on the PC, especially early in the game. Furthermore it means that once more you don't have to obsessively keep up +4 everything since that's taken care of. Less items have to be crafted, so a lot of the wal-mart feel is taken out.

Intelligent items might be able to grant access to higher power levels without taking the talents/having the levels on a temporary basis, but most likely only if the situation is related to the weapon's primary goals, or at cost to the user. However if the item doesn't like you it might reduce your access despite your talents/levels.

 

[kitsune9]

We solved that problem by allowing the crafting wizard to drain XP from his allies when crafting for them. It had to be voluntary, though.

I did that to the players when they wanted to commission powerful magic items. The wizard would take their XP as part of the payment.

 

[Plane Sailing]

I'd like to see it in an optional set on top of the basic core. To my mind 3e+ attempted to explain magic item crafting but undid the balance of magic items and contributed to the 'less magical' feel.

Done as a bolt on rules module it could contain various options from the time + money = bingo approach to the questing for key components for any item approach.

But any mechanism which makes it easy for cheap scrolls and wands to be made is asking for trouble in my mind.

 

[billd91]

I would like to see them moved to the DMG and even then, creating them should be a challenge.

I also would like to see the magic item based on the character's level, so it gets more powerful with him or her as he or she advances.

There are some things in this list I agree with and some I don't. I'll start off by saying I partially agree with this. I'm not sure that a magic item should always get more powerful based on the character's level without additional input. Some could be automatic, but others I would prefer would not.

Potions, scrolls and even wands should be easy to make, granted wands need a special component (like a healing potion needs a strand of hair from a unicorn's mane...willingly)

I agree with potions and scrolls. Not so much with wands. If they continue to be easy to make (from 3e onward), I would significantly reduce the number of charges they incorporate. 3e's wand of cure light wounds is very helpful, particularly in working against PCs trying to take a night's rest on short but hit-point loss heavy adventuring. But it's probably too cheap for its 50 charges.

Arms and Armor should be rare, but also powerful.

<snip>
I think the special abilities added to weapons should (if they can be made) require a quest or something challenging, like a flaming sword needing to be dipped in a volcano or breathed on by a dragon meanwhile a holy sword would need to be blessed by a celestial being (or something similar depending on their religion/deity)

I think armor should be similar, or crafted on magical forges what are ALWAYS guarded by mean nasties who love to not stay dead.

Special abilities may be more evocative in this way, but I totally disagree with these items being rare. One bright spot of random treasure generation in 1e/2e was that the most common items were potions, scrolls, and gear of war - arms and armor. 1e explicitly recognized that some classes were more equipment based than others and skewed the random treasure tables to give them more common tools. Wands, by comparison, are substantially rarer than magic weapons and armor. It was one of the balancing factors between fighters, for example, and magic users. And in 3e it was lost, and exacerbated by the addition of the magic item creation feats with their caster level requirements.

Rings should be in circulation, but few should know they are magical (detect magic goes out the window for rings) meanwhile staffs should always look cool, and just by looking at them you should know what they do.

Wondrous items should have their wonder back.

Cursed items should be a much larger fear.

Agree with your points here. Pathfinder injected a way to get a cursed item by blowing your magic crafting roll, but the DCs are set low enough that this is unlikely unless you're deliberately trying to make something without having all of the required components (which can be dispensed with for an increase in the craft DC).

All items should be unique (no more "+1 keen longswords"
Try +1 keen longsword that can detect poison 2/day, it is named "Kingsfriend"

I can see a point for somethings, particularly with extra powers, being unique, but I still think there's a value to having basic pluses as well. Imagine a sword that's a little bit better than a regular one and how valuable it could be. For simplicity, it works really well to just give it a bonus to hit and damage.

One thing I would take a good hard look at, if there's any component of wealth (or even level) inherent in the expectations of what items PCs will have when, is that items that are always useful have more inflated values than ones that are more situational. My classic example is the ring of shooting stars vs ring of protection. The ring of protection is exceptionally useful, nearly all the time, at any value. The ring of shooting stars has several bits of interesting and quirky, but not particularly powerful, utility in various states of darkness. The ring of protection in 3.5 maxes out at +5 to AC at 50,000 gp. The ring of shooting stars is also 50,000 gp, but is nowhere near as generally useful.
By comparison, in 1e, the ring of shooting stars was 15,000 gp and rings of protection varied in value between 10,000 gp (for a simple +1 to AC and saves) and 20,000 gp. I would submit that the price of the ring of shooting stars is much better in 1e relative to the value of the ring of protection than in 3.5.

 

[CleverNickName]

I am about to start a brand-new 3.5E campaign, and the gang is very excited about it. I'm not looking forward to the Christmas Tree method of character development, where magic items are not only assumed but are required for proper game balance, but I can deal. So to keep the party healthy (and me sane), I am going to house-rule the following for magic item creation.

[SBLOCK]1. The only magic items available for sale are potions and scrolls, both of which must be purchased from temples. There are no special shops in town where magic items may be bought or sold. The party will only find spell components, bottles, and parchments at Ye Olde Magick Shoppe.

2. The only Craft feats available to the party are Brew Potion, Scribe Scroll, Craft Wand, and Craft Staff. In other words, temporary magic items only.

3. Permanent magic items require special weeks-long rituals, rare and exotic ingredients, multiple trips to ancient mystical forges in far-away lands...that sort of thing. Creating a magic sword is a plot device, not a weekend hobby.

4. Magic items of any kind cannot be sold on the open market, for the same reason that batteries can't be returned to Radio Shack: the merchant doesn't know where they came from or where they've been, and cannot guarantee them for resale...it doesn't matter how "new" they look or whether or not you "test them out" first.

That said, it is possible to sell them on the black market, provided that the party can locate a buyer and agree on the price...the process then becomes a plot device, and not a money-making scheme.[/SBLOCK]
I realize that this is just my own personal preference, but I think it would go a long way to eliminating the magic item glut that seems to be so prevalent in the newer editions of D&D. It would be nice to see this canonized into 5th Edition.

 

[billd91]

2. The only Craft feats available to the party are Brew Potion, Scribe Scroll, Craft Wand, and Craft Staff. In other words, temporary magic items only.

3. Permanent magic items require special weeks-long rituals, rare and exotic ingredients, multiple trips to ancient mystical forges in far-away lands...that sort of thing. Creating a magic sword is a plot device, not a weekend hobby.

4. Magic items of any kind cannot be sold on the open market, for the same reason that batteries can't be returned to Radio Shack: the merchant doesn't know where they came from or where they've been, and cannot guarantee them for resale...it doesn't matter how "new" they look or whether or not you "test them out" first.

How to you propose to not screw over the equipment-based classes like fighters compared to wizards? I'm not seeing much to prune back wizard powers here but a lot to prune back martial characters.

 

[avin]

I have a pseudo-mechanic for that in my game, called legend. Things can acquire power of their own by accumulating history and legend around them. You can't make that. This also means that an item created from legend doesn't have to be masterwork, for instance. I have a second pseudo-mechanic called wild magic. Not as in dangerously explosive, but as in untamed. Sometimes powerful events cause ripples in wild magic creating spontaneous magic items out of nothing, like a star coalescing from gas, or sometimes an item becomes infused over time by sitting at a conflux of ley line-like energies. These items often have strange properties that might not even suit the type of item it is.

Nice, nice... a the long lost sword of the dead noble king, when found, is magical... 5E will probably feature less magical items, so this is an option.

In fact, I'm gonna use that on my next One Shot 4E game... or my first 5E betatest.

Crafting magical items should involve spell components just like spells do. These spell components should come from various creatures you meet, defeat and use.

For example, a frost themed blade could be required to be forged on the winter solstice, enchanted with an absorption spell, then used to absorb the breath of a white dragon.

A friend of mine used to do that, after killing a Black Dragon we were able to craft items from it... 5E Magical Items should be created by rituals. Stronger items should need rare items and circunstances to create, such as solstices, heart of mountains, etc...

 

[CleverNickName]

How to you propose to not screw over the equipment-based classes like fighters compared to wizards? I'm not seeing much to prune back wizard powers here but a lot to prune back martial characters.

By changing the base assumption of the classes, and increasing the variety of potions.

Fighters will not be "equipment-based" anymore, but they will be able to improve their prowess in combat for short amounts of time through the use of potions, oils, and other temporary magic items.

A quicksilver potion will make a weapon perform as a +1 silver weapon for 1 hour, for example. Essence of Fire, when applied to a blade, makes it a flaming weapon for 1 minute. Using Dwarven Oil to sharpen your blade will briefly make it a keen +1 weapon. Anointing your dagger with holy water = holy weapon for 1 round. So on and so forth.

I'll admit, it's not for everyone. But I think this house-rule will "fix" a lot of the problems I've had with magic items in 3.5E. Time will tell.

 

[Crazy Jerome]

Goal: to get the PCs to spend their time in the field finding items rather than in the lab building them.

Way to achieve goal: make creation of any item other than a simple potion or scroll take time counted in large numbers of months if not years. Most PCs won't want to take that long of a break, particularly if the rest of the party keeps going and-or the plot runs amok while the party waits. That said, if a PC wants to commission the construction of an item now and come back for it in 6 months or a year or whatever, that's fine.

I like that as a base, but would like it even more if the above is necessary but not sufficient. On top of the time from a skilled crafter, I'd also like there to be a "field work" piece--and not merely retrieving dragon blood or something like that, then using it later. To me, the two key points that should be required are "Time" and "Danger". Having the necessary skill is ok too, but doesn't really add anything to the fantasy. (It is more of a world-building, verisimilitude thing.)

So to use your example, sometime in the six months to a year, the party would also need to go bathe the item in a dangerous location, kill a creature with it, protect the crafter while he summons the right kind of spirit, etc.

I like a magic item system where the creators/commisioners of such need to be a bit addled/driven/eccentric/etc. in order to even consider doing such a thing.

 

[billd91]

By changing the base assumption of the classes, and increasing the variety of potions.

Fighters will not be "equipment-based" anymore, but they will be able to improve their prowess in combat for short amounts of time through the use of potions, oils, and other temporary magic items.

A quicksilver potion will make a weapon perform as a +1 silver weapon for 1 hour, for example. Essence of Fire, when applied to a blade, makes it a flaming weapon for 1 minute. Using Dwarven Oil to sharpen your blade will briefly make it a keen +1 weapon. Anointing your dagger with holy water = holy weapon for 1 round. So on and so forth.

I'll admit, it's not for everyone. But I think this house-rule will "fix" a lot of the problems I've had with magic items in 3.5E. Time will tell.

I can certainly empathize with wanting to get rid of a succession of oddball ways to cobble synergizing gear together. And I think use of potions/oils to put the odd effects of weapon enhancements temporarily on weapons will probably work well.

I would suggest also restricting wands, making them a lot more expensive relative to potions, or getting rid of a whole lot of offensive spells to reduce the power of wizards. Reducing magic items a bit will keep some things out of their hands like persistent defenses. But unless you're prepared to cut them back more, they'll have a lot of tools at their disposal that fighters and rogues can't compete with. Take flying for example. Wizards get the fly spell pretty easily, but at least winged boots and a few other magic items can be wielded by fighters to equalize things out a little bit. Remove the winged boots and that really cuts down a fighter's potential to fly as regularly.

One other idea is the use of weapons and armor with pluses. Those can easily be reskinned (as masterwork nearly is) as varying manufacturing secrets or materials, giving you ways to still allow martial characters to have special persistent advancements. The fortification property of armor is also another good candidate for this treatment. They're all subtle effects and easy to have in low magic setting, particularly if you don't have too many variations on them. Take, for example, Thieves' World's Walegrin character. In Tales from the Vulgar Unicorn, he's on a quest to recover the secret of Enlibar steel - a secret formula for the metal that makes for better weapons. That could be equivalent to a +2 weapon but not actually magical. Food for thought anyway, and one of the reasons I've always liked + weapons in my D&D and would like to see them continue into 5e (to draw this side topic of conversation back around to the point of the thread).

 

[CleverNickName]

A friend of mine used to do that, after killing a Black Dragon we were able to craft items from it... 5E Magical Items should be created by rituals. Stronger items should need rare items and circunstances to create, such as solstices, heart of mountains, etc...

I could get on board with item creation rituals...it makes a lot of sense, especially for story-driven games. Magical items in fantasy novels have excellent stories about how they were forged in the heart of volcanoes or carved from the teeth of dragons.

But, like others have said, it would be too easy to hobble the martial-based classes if magic items are too scarce. The 5E rules would need a way to compensate for the lack of magical firepower at low-to-mid level. That's why I would like to see a larger selection of disposable "potions" that can be used to anoint a weapon and give it a temporary boost.

Wizards get the fly spell pretty easily, but at least winged boots and a few other magic items can be wielded by fighters to equalize things out a little bit. Remove the winged boots and that really cuts down a fighter's potential to fly as regularly.

True, but the party could always purchase a potion of flying or similar item. I can see how a fighter might need to fly on occasion, but being able to fly at will? That's epic magic, the stuff of gods and ancient myths...not something you buy at the store or make in your basement.

One other idea is the use of weapons and armor with pluses.

*snip*

That could be equivalent to a +2 weapon but not actually magical. Food for thought anyway, and one of the reasons I've always liked + weapons in my D&D and would like to see them continue into 5e (to draw this side topic of conversation back around to the point of the thread).

I do too, and I really hope they stay around. I would rather have a variety of non-magical ways to improve gear instead of a list of magical ones, even if the difference is merely cosmetic. Adamantine weapons and armor are excellent examples of this treatment...I'd love to see a larger list of special materials in 5E.