Magic Items that lost their magic

[Storm Raven]

If a character in a comic or movie had "Gauntlets of Ogre Power", they'd work like 4e, not 3.5 -- every so often, that character would use a "signature move" that indicated their incredible strength....much like a daily power...

Yeah, that Thor and his signature moves . . .

 

[Rechan]

The comparison with comic books is particularly off, because the characters with items that give them power? That's their shtick. Their entire power set revolves around those items.

To compare D&D to Comics, it would be like giving Thor's hammer to Wolverine. Or giving Iron Man's suit to Nightcrawer. Now he has his teleportation in addition to all the things Iron Man's suit can do.

Take away Iron Man's suit, and he's just an alcoholic CEO. Take away Spiderman's spidey powers, and he's a smart mouthed scientist. Take away a fighter's Gauntlets of Ogre Power and his Vorpal sword, and he can still kill ogres with a butter knife. Same as if you took Batman's utility belt away from him.

 

[AllisterH]

Yeah, that Thor and his signature moves . . .

Um, that's kind of a prime example of "daily" IMO. Thor has a "belt of strength" that doubles his STRENGTH, but in the comics he doesn't wear it all the time.

When it TRULY has hit the fan, (fighting Kurse, Celestials, the Destroyer armour) that's when he actually puts on the belt...

 

[AllisterH]

Personally, it seems like all the cool items are the artifacts...While the magic items are as boring as 3e items were, the 4e treatment of artifacts is IMO, the best rules treatment artifacts have ever gotten....

 

[gizmo33]

I've also disliked, even with 4e, you still wind up with a closet's worth of magical items. Rarely have I seen in fantasy fiction where a character had more than two magical items.

Fantasy fiction isn't the only measure of what DnD is about. The +X items come from the resource management school of RPGs. So an author might not care whether a character in his novels gains a level, or decides to bump his wisdom to 13 in order to qualify for some feat, but players do, and that's the aspect of the game that these sorts of magic items cater to. IMO it should be easy enough to remove them from the game - especially 4E where the "game-breaking" stuff like flying and invisibility has been nerfed anyway. Just bump the monsters' attacks and defense values down by some fixed amount, like -1 per 5 levels or whatever.

 

[Plane Sailing]

I don't mind that magic items got nerfed in 4e but I think far too many items have really crappy dailies. Almost always I'm looking for items with a decent property not a once per day little firecracker.

I agree, properties trump daily powers on most of the magic items I look at.

 

[Rechan]

Fantasy fiction isn't the only measure of what DnD is about. The +X items come from the resource management school of RPGs. So an author might not care whether a character in his novels gains a level, or decides to bump his wisdom to 13 in order to qualify for some feat, but players do, and that's the aspect of the game that these sorts of magic items cater to.

+X items aren't there just for the fiddly bits. They're not just feats or bumping stats. +X items are in D&D for nostalgia/sacred cows. The designers themselves said "We had to keep in +1 swords, because everyone understands what a +1 sword means". Other RPGs don't have the +X items in them, so it's a concept only to D&D.

It's not just fantasy literature to me. +X items are boring. I am aware that people like to increase their stats - I like to increase my stats - but, that's not what magic is, to me. Magic isn't "Now I have a +5% chance of hitting something".

And, one doesn't even need to fiddle with monsters - just give a +X in their math at the levels that players are expected to get the +X. Level 1: +1. Level 6: +2 to Attack/Defenses.

Mearls suggested this if you wanted "Low magic" games.

 

[vagabundo]

+X items aren't there just for the fiddly bits. They're not just feats or bumping stats. +X items are in D&D for nostalgia/sacred cows. The designers themselves said "We had to keep in +1 swords, because everyone understands what a +1 sword means". Other RPGs don't have the +X items in them, so it's a concept only to D&D.

It's not just fantasy literature to me. +X items are boring. I am aware that people like to increase their stats - I like to increase my stats - but, that's not what magic is, to me. Magic isn't "Now I have a +5% chance of hitting something".

And, one doesn't even need to fiddle with monsters - just give a +X in their math at the levels that players are expected to get the +X. Level 1: +1. Level 6: +2 to Attack/Defenses.

Mearls suggested this if you wanted "Low magic" games.

So if we ripped +X items out what are we left with?

We'd have to give PCs an +1/ half tier or so and we're left with flavour items..

 

[Rechan]

We'd have to give PCs an +1/ half tier or so and we're left with flavour items..

Exactly.

 

[AllisterH]

So if we ripped +X items out what are we left with?

We'd have to give PCs an +1/ half tier or so and we're left with flavour items..

And is this a bad thing?

For example if 4e had gone the route of slaugtering the "+X magic item" coy, you could then strip the PCs of their gear and they would still be badass characters...as you mention, it is easy enough to do right now in 4e and I like having that option.

I kind of hated the fact that magic items overshadowed character ability since in a lot of ways, it basically means that the character itself could be replaced with say a 1st level peasant and the peasant would do almost as well.

IF a magic item is going to so "powerful" in relation to the character, it should be a "plot point" and nt just a random item a.k.a, it should be an artifact.