Magic Users too Tough??

[Crow Caller]

"What, you can't corner the mage in a tavern? In a dungeon corridor? In his inn room?"

Unfortunately the only Magic Users in Inns are the ones that haven't figured out yet that they don't need to mingle with the "Commoners" (The rest of the Party) the can create a Mansion and dine on the finest foods in the presence of Celestials!!

Beside what self respecting pscitsophrenic paranoid Wizard would chill in an Inn without a list of wards as long as a greatsword? He would Atleast fill the Inn with Assassins he's paid off with petried Fighter he turned in Platinum last week!!!

If he was REALLY Starved for company he could always cast an Illusion of an inn "Fail" his save and then mind blank himself, by the time he figures out why everyone's being so nice to him he's had enough of company and it's back Plotting the same think he always plts... How t Take over the World!!!!


Cheers

 

[Thanee]

I beleive that a Fighter of 15th level should have a 50% of besting a Magic User of 15th level WITHOUT having to use magic.

And that's where your fault lies. This comparison is of little to no relevance for the class balance.

Anyways, even with magic, a fighter 15th has less than a 50% chance to best a wizard 15th. But the fighter 5th will most likely have a higher than 50% chance instead. But even that is unimportant, because that is not what classes have to be compared against (each other, that is).

A fighter should have about the same impact (on average) at succeeding on an adventure as a wizard, or cleric, or rogue.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Thanee]

Aust Dont try it on the Fighter STUPID! ! ! Dominate His Barbarian buddie thats WAY Easier, then tell BoBo to bash Mr. Fighter for you (Whilst you help with a few Magic Missiles)

Barbarians have more Will save than fighters... while raging at least.

Just yesterday my Brother's first level cleric single handedly killed and Ogre by commanding it to "die" it fell over thinking it was dead and he coup de graced it.

No wonder you think magic is way over the top, if you allow stuff like this (which clearly does not work by the rules).

Bye
Thanee

 

[Thanee]

Yeah tell me about it, I "fix" this adding two little 0's to the end of ALL Magic Item prices and to the End of of the cost to pay a Magic User to cast spells. All of a sudden Magic Weapons are a lot less common, (In my games I assume 100 times less common) and if you get one You Bloddy well Keep it!!! No prancing off to the market to swap in your +1 long sword for a +1 short short and change! If you aren't trained in long sword, you better learn, or keep it for your son!

That's certainly possible to do so, but (as you obviously noticed) it does not work with D&D (without removing all spellcasters from the list of playable classes, that is).

Maybe you should try something like A Game of Thrones or Iron Heroes, or maybe Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay, where magic is FAR less common than it is assumed to be in D&D.

Really, I don't think D&D is the game you want to play.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Crow Caller]

Quote:
"No wonder you think magic is way over the top, if you allow stuff like this (which clearly does not work by the rules). "

How does this "not work by the rules?"

He cast the Spell, the Ogre failed it's save and dropped "Dead" then he Coup de Graced it. Where is the error in this? If there is one I would love to know, there's only one Ogre left in town

 

[Thanee]

There are at least two glaring errors in there, actually.

1) Command doesn't allow to command someone to 'drop dead' anymore. Closest thing is Halt, which let's them stand still for a round. It specifically mentions, that the target is not helpless.

2) Command has a duration of 1 round only, so by the time the cleric can deliver the coup de grace (a full-round action), the spell's duration is over already.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Crow Caller]

We are using Standard 3.0 rules so any rule changes from 3.5 I do not know about, however if they are found somewhere in a 3.0 book could you point me in the right direction? T&B perhaps?

And if Command has a duration of 1 round, and coup de graces akes one round, I still do not see the problem?

 

[Crow Caller]

PS:

Does anyone have the statistics for Tenser's Transformation that can post on here? (My freind has all of my books at his house except my trusty old Monster's of Faerun )

Cheers.

 

[Thanee]

Even under 3.0, I highly doubt, that Command can render the target helpless.

As for the duration... let's assume the Cleric has initiative 10 and the Ogre initiative 6.

Round 1

10 Cleric's action: Cleric casts Command. Afterwards moves next to the Ogre.
Duration begins now.
6 Ogre's action: Ogre 'dies'.

Round 2

Duration ends right before the Cleric's action.
10 Cleric's action: Coup de grace. Doesn't work, since the Ogre is not helpless.
6 Ogre's action: Stand up and smack Cleric for making Ogre drop prone.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Crow Caller]

This does not seem like a round to me,

Take a Cleric, he wins Init and cast Command, (1 Action) that takes about one Second, So the Spell begins at the start of the 2nd Second. Which means it ends at the start of the 2nd Second and the Cleric still gets one second to attack (sure this isn't enough time to perform a full round action, but he can still run away or something (say 30 feet from first round and 30 feet this round) He still "Beat" the Ogre and gets XP for it. Or he could simply make a single free attack on it, or tie it up or any other action that only requires a Move Equivalent Action, a Free Action, a Partial Action or an Attack Action, long story short, Cleric beats Ogre) Or if really needs to, he can command the Ogre to "die" and then let the fighter coup de grasse it. Who do you think will get credit for the kill? And Really, who deserves it?

Cheers.