Mana, Shamans, and the Cultural Misappropriation behind Fantasy Terms

[Aldarc]

I actually don't think Priest is a wide enough umbrella if you want to be inclusive to everyone. Many religions, including many Christian denominations don't have Priests. And the religions that do have them could easily make the same argument that are being made for Shaman.

I suspect that “priest” is more applicable of a term for most spiritual leaders than either “druid,” “cleric,” or “shaman.”

 

[Aldarc]

Fair enough, but you are still stifling peoples language. And I think the reason you get such backlash against it is because language and the words we use and know, these are often just natural ways we communicate. When you start making people second guess that, it puts people on edge and it reduces their ability to comfortably be creative. I would liken it to having a boss who goes over every little thing you type in an email or report, and attacks the frills rather than the meat of the material. Enough of that, and it just has a chilling effect on your ability to communicate. And this is fundamentally about communication.

In the case of how words are used. I just think there are a lot of very bad arguments, perhaps well intentioned, that equate accuracy and authenticity with morally good, and inaccuracy or inauthenticity with morally bad. But that stifles a very important part of creativity and of cultural exchange. Borrowing thing X and using it to create a new thing is what breathes life into stuff. If you can only use it in a certain approved way....I don't know. It just seems like you are killing peoples ability to make new things. Why should the word have to match the original context in any way? Just look at a word like Zombies. Those evolved into their own unique monster when the term was borrowed. Sometimes terms are misunderstood as well, and this accidentally creates something new and interesting. I just don't see why we need to wring our hands over something like that.

I am so sorry that my earnest call for us to respectfully consider how we use these culturally misunderstood terms in our fantasy elf game oppresses you as a creative.

 

[Sepulchrave II]

I suspect that “priest” is more applicable of a term for most spiritual leaders than either “druid,” “cleric,” or “shaman.”

I agree. I understand that priest might have narrower connotations for members of certain groups or denominations, but it's the only relatively neutral catch-all term we have - phenomenologically speaking.

In our world, a shaman is someone who:

• Uses ecstasy as a method to contact a spirit or divine world and "travel" within it
• Acts as an intercessor for spirits to purportedly effect changes in our world - especially divination and healing
• Exhibits dress, speech and other behaviours which set them apart from "regular people"
• Occupies a social role which permits/requires the violation of certain taboos

In the D&D-verse, a shaman is someone who acts as a religious functionary for "primitive" groups and "savage humanoids" - i.e. a priest.

 

[Bedrockgames]

I am so sorry that my earnest call for us to respectfully consider how we use these culturally misunderstood terms in our fantasy elf game oppresses you as a creative.

If you want to have a discussion we can have one. If you want to just make snarky quips, I am not going to reply.

 

[TaranTheWanderer]

I agree. I understand that priest might have narrower connotations for members of certain groups or denominations, but it's the only relatively neutral catch-all term we have - phenomenologically speaking.

In our world, a shaman is someone who:

• Uses ecstasy as a method to contact a spirit or divine world and "travel" within it
• Acts as an intercessor for spirits to purportedly effect changes in our world - especially divination and healing
• Exhibits dress, speech and other behaviours which set them apart from "regular people"
• Occupies a social role which permits/requires the violation of certain taboos

In the D&D-verse, a shaman is someone who acts as a religious functionary for "primitive" groups and "savage humanoids" - i.e. a priest.

This is interesting. So, in essence, the D&D-verse has it backwards? In my mind, this description of Shaman fits people's perception of a Cleric's role in the game.

 

[TaranTheWanderer]

Enough of that, and it just has a chilling effect on your ability to communicate. And this is fundamentally about communication.

I am so sorry that my earnest call for us to respectfully consider how we use these culturally misunderstood terms in our fantasy elf game oppresses you as a creative.

How do you feel this comment affects communication?

 

[Maxperson]

Why? Who is complaining about the Druid? Is there some issue with druid that has been brought up or are you inventing issues that don't exist.

Either it's okay to borrow things from other cultures that aren't completely accurate or it isn't okay. If we aren't supposed to use inaccurate Samurai, then Japan and other non-Celtic cultures aren't supposed to use inaccurate Druids. It's not a pick and choose sort of thing.

 

[Bedrockgames]

... my earnest call for us to respectfully consider how we use these culturally misunderstood terms ...

Focusing on the non-snark , I think this isn't what you are doing. Like I said, it may be well-intentioned. This may be your intention. But if you look at my post I was commenting on how authentic and accurate is being equated with morally good (and in this case I think you are equating 'respectful' largely with authentic and accurate. I don't think people have to understand a term in its original context in order to use it, and to use it without being disrespectful. But the bar for something being considered disrespectful is so low here, and that is the problem. I do get your intentions. But I think the result is people just feel like they are having their words policed. And I don't think that is good for creators, or for gamers. It produces more pablum content.

 

[Maxperson]

”Priest” is commonly used outside of D&D instead of “cleric” with basically no problems or people complaining about the term. There are other terms that could work just as well. We have evocative terms like seer, oracle, augur, prophet, soothsayer, and the like.

Priests are commonly used in multiple religions and would probably offend some people.

 

[Aldarc]

If you want to have a discussion we can have one. If you want to just make snarky quips, I am not going to reply.

It may be best if you don’t then. It’s scarcely a discussion if you are just gonna accuse me of being an oppressor of language and creativity just because I suggested a little critical and cultural reflection on how we use words in our hobby.