Maximum skill results?

[hong]

The ELH writer made a bad call. I agree that walking on clouds is in the realm of 'bending the laws of reality' - it perhaps makes sense as a monk ki power, not as a regular skill check. Unless clouds in your campaign are very different from on Earth, there's nothing there to 'balance' on.

Note that being able to make a DC 100 Balance check in the first place is probably also a candidate for "bending the laws of reality".

 

[Utrecht]

Not that being able to make a DC 100 Balance check in the first place is probably also a candidate for "bending the laws of reality".

Exactly, it makes me wonder why people are perfectly willing to suspend belief that a Level 5 wizard can hide in plain sight (invis) - but won't for a Level 10 Rogue.......

The fact of the matter is the these high level of skills represent such extraordinary people who have focused so much of thier being on doing something - that their abilities are now supernatural.

Further, we are OK with James Bond jumping out of Airplanes without a parachute - yet making it safely (all through his skill) but we are unwilling to let our equally fantastic Bard diplomicize a Lich????

Why the distinction?

 

[dogoftheunderworld]

Come right down, let me show ya' somethin'

There is no diplomacy check high enough to have a arch lich hand over his power.

I would hope that a lich would have a few tricks up its own sleeves, but if its Intelliegnce were to drop several points, you might have a chance

There is no bluff check high enough to convince a person looking at a blue sky that it is in fact green.

Bluff is more of a "just long enough to get away" type of skill, so I can definately see this happening. Some people are very easily deceived, especially "in the moment". I could pull this off right now, with several members of my family (well, not my six year old, but my sister-- sure.

There is no hide check high enough to hide in a bare, featureless, round room with a central light source.

This mostly depends on the circumstance and, again, is opposed my someone else's check. If you aren't looking for someone, it is easy to pass them by without noticing at all.

There is no move silently check high enough to move at normal speed in platemail right behind an alert guard.

See above, if the guard is really alert it would be pretty difficult without the old Jedi mind trick, but that is definately an Epic skill.

There is no survival tracking check high enough to know who passed a week ago when yesterday 30 head of cattle were driven over this road in the rain.

As seen in above posts, not at that spot, but they should be able to pick up the trail.

 

[Altalazar]

While I agree there are probably some things that are just impossible, I think anything not impossible should be allowed with a skill check.

Sure, it might be hard or even ridiculously hard, but one of the things that I think is cool about 3rd Edition is a fully realized skill system. And I see skills as others have seen them - as another ability, akin to special abilities and even spells, that a character has.

The nice thing about skills is that you don't need to memorize them or get material components, or sometimes even any equipment at all to utilize them.

I made a character with a ridiculously high jump / climb / balance skills, further enhanced by magic, and then that was part of his character - he was one of the 'monkey-like' race in Oriental Adventures. He climbed everywhere, almost never walking along the ground if he could avoid it. With skill levels in about an 8th or 9th level campaign that exceeded 20 or 30 (I can't recall the exact numbers) he could do quite a large number of impressive climbing and jumping. He was a fun and interesting character, and it was because of his skills, in part. It just wouldn't have worked as well if it was about magic spells or other things as opposed to just an inherent part of who he was.

Plus, it is fun to try an do something hard, then roll the dice and see what happens. I have been toying with the idea of a skill roll system similar to what Shadowrun has - if you roll a 20, you can roll again and add the second roll, possibly rolling again if you get a second 20, and so on, though that will require some thought. (And with a 1 resulting in a negative result of some sort).

 

[Voadam]

Plus, it is fun to try an do something hard, then roll the dice and see what happens. I have been toying with the idea of a skill roll system similar to what Shadowrun has - if you roll a 20, you can roll again and add the second roll, possibly rolling again if you get a second 20, and so on, though that will require some thought. (And with a 1 resulting in a negative result of some sort).

A pre 3e campaign I was in in college did this, 20 means roll again add on the next roll. 1 means -20 plus the roll. Open endedness only went one direction. A 1 followed by a 20 comes out to zero, no more rollings.

 

[Voadam]

Exactly, it makes me wonder why people are perfectly willing to suspend belief that a Level 5 wizard can hide in plain sight (invis) - but won't for a Level 10 Rogue.......

The fact of the matter is the these high level of skills represent such extraordinary people who have focused so much of thier being on doing something - that their abilities are now supernatural.

Further, we are OK with James Bond jumping out of Airplanes without a parachute - yet making it safely (all through his skill) but we are unwilling to let our equally fantastic Bard diplomicize a Lich????

Why the distinction?

a wizard can use magic to hide in plain sight so why does it take more to hide in plain sight using nonmagical means. Is that your question? Seems straightforward that even low level magic can do things that skill alone can't. Say create a cone of magical fire (burning hands).

So at what level do high level skills gain the SU descriptor? When can they be stopped by an antimagic field or a dispel magic? If your epic character steps through a gate to a nonmagical world, are the effects of his skills lessened?

 

[Henry]

I would hope that a lich would have a few tricks up its own sleeves, but if its Intelliegnce were to drop several points, you might have a chance.

Not intelligence, wisdom. I've seen plenty of people in real life who were very smart but extremely gullible.

And I don't know about the sky, but I can convince someone that the light from the sun is white, not yellow. It's the same reason the sky is blue - light diffraction.


BTW, speaking of Arcana Unearthed, an optimally built AU character can have a +22 Diplomacy skill at 2nd level. that's enough to change some one from a hostile to helpful reaction on a die roll of 18!

 

[LostSoul]

Most groups (not just DMs) will have to decide how things play out in their games. I think it comes down to a matter of personal opinion.

What do the rules say, though?

There is no move silently check high enough to move at normal speed in platemail right behind an alert guard.

What's the DC for this?

The guard makes a listen check of 10 to 15 (if we're generous).

You have a penalty to Move Silently of -12.

You can do this skill half the time with a skill modifier of +12 to +17. If you have +22 to +27, you can always do this.

Very possible, per the rules.

 

[Nasma]

Green is actually the portion of the spectrum most emitted by the sun. I could see someone using something like this to convince them that the sky is green.

 

[Trainz]

About diplomacy and bluff checks...

There has been, in our recent history (past 50 years), in REAL LIFE, guys who convinced groups of people (americans in some cases), to commit mass suicide.

So there is NOTHING that, in D&D, cannot be achieved by diplomacy. Convince someone to give you his most prized magic item ? If in real life you can convince someone to die, I don't see how impossible it his to convince someone to do ANYTHING. Sure, the DC will vary, but that's it.

Some of you will say "but the people who where convinced to commit such an act might have been mentally ill to begin with".

So ? Is it so hard to stretch the notion of very good diplomacy and bluff skills to make someone give you his stuff, especially in a magical universe ?