Mercurial Weapons -- good idea or bad idea?

[arwink]

I think DMuhcneon's comment is based around the idea that the balance point moves in these weapons as the mercury shifts position and adds extra weight to a downward strike. All the other weapons stated have a constant point of balance, as unweildy as it may be. Mercurial weapons don't.

 

[Vaxalon]

That's fine, but the mercurial sword's balance AT ITS WORST is going to be no worse than a mace's balance.

I still don't find the argument convincing.

 

[Sir Osis of Liver]

I never tought of it before, but no one i game with trys to mni-max with weapons. We seem to just take whatever fits with our individual character concepts. I my self have used the Gyr spike and Fullblade, just because they either look cool, or fit with the character background. Now i'm going to have to seriously take a look at these things before i allow them.

 

[arwink]

That's fine, but the mercurial sword's balance AT ITS WORST is going to be no worse than a mace's balance.

I still don't find the argument convincing.

*shrug*

I'll leave it to him to argue that in more depth. I put up with an awful amount of silliness in flavor text due to the nature of fantasy, and if I wanted mercurial weapons I'd just assume that dwarves and/or gnomes have found a way to make it viable.

I'm personally still against them on a crunchy level.

 

[MeepoTheMighty]

Second, hollowing out your sword blade makes it weaker - mercurial weapons should have far lower hardness and hit points than normal weapons of their type.

If that's the case, then Mr. Wizard lied to me. I distinctly remember an episode of the show where he hung a weight from a solid steel rod which bent, and then hung one from a hollow steel rod which stayed rigid.

 

[buzzard]

If that's the case, then Mr. Wizard lied to me. I distinctly remember an episode of the show where he hung a weight from a solid steel rod which bent, and then hung one from a hollow steel rod which stayed rigid.

Let me put my metallurgist hat on here and explain.
There are two reasons why this can occur. The first is that the radii are different. For a given weight of metal, the greater the radius, the greater the strength in bending since bending moments are strongly dependent on this. If they had identical radii there are two other possible explanations. First it simple be because the tube would have been given more cold work which will increase the yield strength. The second possibility is that the weight of the solid rod itself was adding to the force appreciably, and caused the bending, while the tube was lighter.

In a mercurial sword you are setting yourself up for failure. While a hollow tube is certainly good for resisting bending moments, the moment it gets dented it becomes very weak. The day to day uses of a sword involve hitting hard things like armor and parrying other swords. All of these would cause dents and make the structure extremely weak.
Also making a good sword requires some metallurgical tricks to make it good. A sword has to be both hard and soft. The hard part to keep the edge, and the soft part to keep it from cracking. This was generally done by either welding on harder steel for the edge or surface carburizing. The Japanese used an interesting technique of covering part of the blade (the non sharp edge) with clay and then quenching it. differing quench rates will make for very different final metal properties.

If you take the sword which is to be mercurial and hollow it out, you have removed the material which is ductile (soft), and left only the hard outer layers of the metal. This will lead to a brittle weapon of little use in normal combat. Yes, it would be fine for a little "orf wit 'is 'ead!", but one it was parried you'd have a broken blade.

buzzard

 

[S'mon]

Bad. Bad. Bad.

If you're running 'Book of the New Sun' d20 (or something like Dragonstar with a similar mix of tech levels), then Good. Otherwise Bad. Terminus Est was clearly a product of advanced (millions of years in our future) technology applied to a very old problem.

 

[CRGreathouse]

Too silly, too abusable. They're out.

 

[Quip]

Oh my, it looks like a lot of you are talking about the pre-errata version. Those stats are so ridiculous that I dont even imagine anyone actually using them.

Unless people actually have a problem with just the x4 crit?

Other than that its just a matter of conceptual silliness, and I've already posted my solution to that, ne?

 

[DWARF]

I think I must re-iterate the balance issue. No, not play balance...

One of the main factors in creating a blade, a longsword or even a rapier or saber for fencing, is that you have to have the balance point just right. If it's off by an inch, that blade won't function well in combat. Talk to someone who fences a lot and they'll tell you a good balance point is as important as the blade's weight.

With a mercurial weapon, the balance point is continually changing. Yes, a mace may not have an excellent balance point when it comes to parrying blows, but one of the critical things is that in a mace, the balance point is CONSTANT! A changing balance point on a sword goes against one of the basic fundamentals of sword making. Now, if you imposed a -4 AC penalty to anyone using it, then maybe I could see the mechanic reflecting reality, but as is, errated or no...
BAD!