Meta-Magic Rod + Spell Storing Item

[Kabol]

Ok, if I use a ring of spell storing and fire it off while im holding onto a meta-magic rod, will teh spell im releasing become meta-magic'd?

Will that work for non spell casters? Could a fighter with a spell storing item hold onto a Meta-magic rod of quicken - or even better a Persistant Meta-magic rod? Would he then be able to have persistant Divine power, or Polymorph?

Personaly, i dont know where i stand on the Idea - to me it seems Very powerful, But then agian persistant meta-magic rod is prob hella expensive. What do you all think?

 

[Thanee]

No, you cannot metamagic a spell from a ring of spellstoring.

You probably can metamagic a spell with the rod while casting it into a ring of spellstoring, and then release the metamagicked spell from there, but it would require a ring, which can store a spell of the modified spell level, of course.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Kabol]

That sounds right - if you could meta-magic from spell storing item the artificer would be insane

< well - more insane >

 

[Scharlata]

No, you cannot metamagic a spell from a ring of spellstoring.

Why? The use activation method implies a standard action or no action at all. Holding a metamagic rod should require no action at all, since you can't cast a spell (as a standard action) with another standard action for using the metamagic rod. The conclusion must be: It's no action at all using the metamagic rod. If we take this as a base for adjucating the casting of a spell either personally or from a ring of spell storing that magically imparts the use of its stored spells for all character classes, we must come to the conclusion that you can indeed use a metamagic rod to modify a spell cast from a ring of spell storing, because the ring has an minimum activation time of one standard action combined with no action at all from the metamagic rod.

You probably can metamagic a spell with the rod while casting it into a ring of spellstoring, and then release the metamagicked spell from there, but it would require a ring, which can store a spell of the modified spell level, of course.

But the metamagic rod explicitly does not modify the spell slot, so there is no need for a special ring of spell storing. You might maximize a fireball with a metamagic rod of maximize (still 3rd level spell) and cast it into a lesser ring of spell storing.

I could imagine a wizard that empowers the stored maximized fireball on the fly with a metamagic rod of empower...

Kind regards

 

[Thanee]

You do not cast the spell from the ring, otherwise non-spellcaster could not use it. Hence, no metamagic rod.

And the ring specifically says what to do with metamagicked spells.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Scharlata]

Hi!

You do not cast the spell from the ring, otherwise non-spellcaster could not use it.

The ring of spell storing states that anyone can use the ring to cast a stored spell. So, the wearer of the ring - whether true spellcaster or no spellcaster at all - casts a spell. So she is a "spellcaster" at the time she casts a spell. Besides, I don't understand the chain of argument in your above quoted sentence. Both parts of the sentence make no sense to me. I'm sorry. First, you indeed cast a spell from the ring, and second, if you normally are a nonspellcaster you are now one for the purposes of casting a stored spell from the ring (the ring imparts all needed knowledge to a nonspellcaster to cast a spell stored in it).

Hence, no metamagic rod.

I'm not receiving your "quod erat demonstrandum [q.e.d.]". If you are a spellcaster, then you can't metamagic a spell?; If you aren't you can/you cannot? I don't follow you, Thanee. Please explain your chain of arguments again to me.

And the ring specifically says what to do with metamagicked spells.

That's because the ring "didn't know" that in 3.5 there were metamagic rods, if I may say this. The metamagic rod explicitly mentions that you do not alter the spell slot. The ring of spell storing mentions that metamagicked spells tend to have a higher spell level. But if one magic items (as a part of its power) circumvents a limitation and especially mentions a procedure (as: no spell level alteration), I succumb to do right that, even if some other magic items does not mention the possibility of exceptions to the rule.

Kind regards

 

[Thanee]

Well, sure, it's still casting in a way, but it's not normal spellcasting. The ring gets activated like every other magic item. You don't need components, and whatnot, that's only necessary for placing the spell, not releasing. A non-spellcaster with the ring does not cast the spell like a spellcaster or is a spellcaster. It's just someone using a magic item.

Even with a spell trigger item, like a wand, you cannot do that, why should it work with a ring of spellstoring!?

Of course the metamagic rod does not modify the spell level, but the spell is still a metamagicked spell.

If a wizard casts a spell with the rod, then the base spell comes from the spell slot and the metamagic "energy" from the rod. The ring has to provide the complete "energy", since you cannot cast the spell like a spellcaster would.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Li Shenron]

In the largely unlikely eventuality that there ever were any metamagic rod in any of my settings, I would strictly disallow the rod to work on spells cast from other magic items.

 

[No Way]

If we were going by just the rules, I would have to say Schar is right. However, any DM worth their weight in D20s would slap you with the DMG if you tried to do that.

 

[cordell]

I quoted the entire text on spell storing from SRD.PDF below.

Part 1 - is the spell cast from the ring a "spell"? I [humbly] agree with Thanee. The ring is *activated*, as it says in this sentence here: [The activation time for the ring is same as the casting time for the relevant spell, with a minimum of 1 standard action.] Once you agree that the spell inside the ring is activated, NOT cast, a lot of stuff falls into place. You don't need any spellcasting ability like you might with a Wand, you don't need to make Concentration checks, etc, etc.

Part 2 - Can you metamagic a spell with a Rod, before you put it into the ring? This is a little less clear. These 2 sentences [Metamagic versions of spells take up storage space equal to their spell level modified by the metamagic feat.] and [A spellcaster can use a scroll to put a spell into the minor ring of spell storing.] would have me believe that a caster could use items to place the spell into the ring. If you can use items, you should be able to use Rods, too.

Of course, as a player, I would totally understand a DM taking the "hard line" regarding part 2 - Not allowing the combining of the power of the Ring and a metamagic Rod. It's Very Powerful.

On a side note, storing a Quickened Spell (even if you have to add the +4 levels) doesn't seem worth it - since the Ring still requires an activation time of 1 standard action. Or did I miss something?

---------------------------
Spell Storing, Minor: A minor ring of spell storing contains up to three levels of spells that the wearer can cast. Each spell has a caster level equal to the minimum level needed to cast that spell. The user need not provide any material components or focus, or pay an XP cost to cast the spell, and there is no arcane spell failure chance for wearing armor (because the ring wearer need not gesture). The activation time for the ring is same as the casting time for the relevant spell, with a minimum of 1 standard action.
For a randomly generated ring, treat it as a scroll to determine what spells are stored in it. If you roll a spell that would put the ring over the three-level limit, ignore that roll; the ring has no more spells in it. (Not every newly discovered ring need be fully charged.)
A spellcaster can cast any spells into the ring, so long as the total spell levels do not add up to more than three. Metamagic versions of spells take up storage space equal to their spell level modified by the metamagic feat. A spellcaster can use a scroll to put a spell into the minor ring of spell storing. The ring magically imparts to the wearer the names of all spells currently stored