middle age swords

[Hussar]

Darklone is correct I think. The spear or the polearm has long been the soldier's primary weapon rather than the sword. Makes a fair bit of sense too if you think about it.

On the point of weapon quality. Don't forget Damascus steel which is certainly comparable to pretty much anything of the period.

Robberbaron - sorry for the snark. Long day. But, really, ARMA is just ten ways of cool if you like to get a bit more real world in your fantasy. There's an article on there about the battalaglia (sp) which as an Italian stick fight on a bridge in the 15th century. Regular occurance apparently. It made an appearance in my Shelzar (Scarred Lands) campaign and just might make a repeat in my next game.

 

[Darklone]

Well, you can kill an armored dude with a sword, but it's difficult and hard to do... for a farmer, it's so much easier with an axe

Especially in a battle... we're not talking about a duel. In a battle, you jump forward and hack, if you're faster, you've won. Not much sense using a sword if you don't know how to.

 

[Henry]

One thing to remember about katanas were that they were great weapons despite their steel - the iron ore typically worked by Asian smiths was inferior to steel procured in Europe and the middle east, until later on. All that folding and re-folding, etc. was to work out impurities, and the cutting and slashing maneuvers of katanas were developed to downplay the swords' weaknesses. There's a reason Damascus Steel was well-known.

I always appreciate sites like ARMA reviving what little is known of the European and Near-Eastern martial arts that disappeared with the proliferation of firearms. It's a great field of study.

 

[HalfOrc HalfBiscuit]

Another website you might like to look at:

The Mediaeval Sword

 

[lukelightning]

The "sharpened crowbar" idea is, I believe, something created by katana fanboys.

 

[DungeonMaester]

The "sharpened crowbar" idea is, I believe, something created by katana fanboys.

My thoughts exactly. Only, If I where to say it in the manner I wanted to say it, I would be in the middle of a flame war.

Orential weapons derived from the middle east anyway. Fan boys retort by saying 'Well, the Middle east is part of the Orential. To which I respond "Like hell it is." It may or may not be, but I say that because it shows I have no interest in a anime mind controlled katana fanboy has to say.

---Rusty

 

[Celebrim]

The "sharpened crowbar" idea is, I believe, something created by katana fanboys.

Pretty much exactly.

I always find it interesting that Katana fanboys are always into comparing European mass produced swords to the specially commissioned works of Japanese master swordsmiths. The vast majority of period Japanese swords were no better than thier European counterparts, because it was too expensive to produce 10000 swords by the standards you'd use for a high ranking samurii's sword.

I'm reminded of how much scorn was heaped on the surviving Western melee martial arts by devotees of Eastern martial arts, until the two were actually used in something like an open contact competition. You don't hear that so much any more, after the practicioners of ancient martial arts all got thier butts kicked and the only eastern martial arts traditions left standing were the ones that were most modern and most influenced by contact with the West (shoot fighting, for example). If you want to idolize actual skilled and useful Eastern martial arts, and not peasants wishfully thinking they could defend themselves against armored swordsman, then look to the Mongols. That's some serious martial art. Kung Fu? Not so much.

Let me be as damning as I can be and get it out of the way. The general continuing emphasis in the far east on unarmed combat techniques, improvised weapons, melee combat techniques is a product not of thier superior skill in these areas, but how much longer it took in the far east to develop sophisticated notions of individual and civil rights, coordinated unit tactics, military professionalism, and firearms technology. The West, in Greece, had 'Karate' back in 400 BC. They just largely abandoned it as obselete technology, and tended to retain it only in a sport form - and generally then only if it was easily adapted to something that wasn't so much a blood sport.

 

[lukelightning]

Plus crowbars are pretty wicked. In crowbar vs. katana, my money would be on the crowbar(I mean hitting one with the other, not people weilding them).

 

[Darklone]

anime fanboy =|= guy who knows something real about swords.

 

[shurai]

I'm reminded of how much scorn was heaped on the surviving Western melee martial arts by devotees of Eastern martial arts, until the two were actually used in something like an open contact competition. You don't hear that so much any more, after the practicioners of ancient martial arts all got thier butts kicked and the only eastern martial arts traditions left standing were the ones that were most modern and most influenced by contact with the West (shoot fighting, for example). If you want to idolize actual skilled and useful Eastern martial arts, and not peasants wishfully thinking they could defend themselves against armored swordsman, then look to the Mongols. That's some serious martial art. Kung Fu? Not so much.

Let me be as damning as I can be and get it out of the way. The general continuing emphasis in the far east on unarmed combat techniques, improvised weapons, melee combat techniques is a product not of thier superior skill in these areas, but how much longer it took in the far east to develop sophisticated notions of individual and civil rights, coordinated unit tactics, military professionalism, and firearms technology. The West, in Greece, had 'Karate' back in 400 BC. They just largely abandoned it as obselete technology, and tended to retain it only in a sport form - and generally then only if it was easily adapted to something that wasn't so much a blood sport.

Excuse me, but I almost have to assume this is a troll. Do you really mean all this stuff?