Mike Mearls Talks (er, Tweets) About the Industry

I think history has proven Mike wrong. The problem is that D&D isn't a game. D&D is a framework that allows 5 players to make a game.

So if you like boardgames, you got lots of different games to choose from. If you like RPGs, you got lots of games to choose from. But those games are the things GMs do with D&D. My campaign is my own game I've developed. Your campaign is yours.

I think there's a market for lots of different RPGs in that sense. Because each gaming group playing D&D is running its own unique game, in their own homebrew setting with their own house rules.

But I don't think there's a market for different *frameworks*. I think there's demand for *a* framework, that players use to develop lots of different games.

 

[Celtavian]

Dominate the media where exactly??? I would say that I am pretty up to date with regards to gaming and the media and I don't remember 5th edition D&D dominating the media so could you refresh my memory when this happened?

Let's break a few things down here because I don't see anything specific that D&D 5th edition has done that previous editions and other games hasn't done.

1: Forbes and USA Today- Okay so D&D get's a mention in these two. How many gamers read Forbes magazine exactly and what about the rest of the world and parts of the US that don't read USA Today?

2: New York Times Best Seller list: How long has Bob been a part of this list? Years and years so what makes D&D 5th edition any more special with regards to this? 4th edition actually made this list as well.

3: Playing Princes of the Apoc: Not everyone is playing this AP or any of the other APs. I would bet more people are playing homebrew games than these APs. Sounds a bit like smoke and mirrors to me if they are reporting everyone is playing these APs when in actual fact they aren't.

What I am seeing here is a lot of spin and smoke and mirrors. There is nothing there that is unique to the current edition of D&D so trying to paint 5th edition as some ground breaking edition that has taken the media by storm is just flat out false and heavy wishful thinking.

Have you seen D&D in the following:

1: Ads on TV.
2: Ads in cinemas.
3: Displays in video game shops such as Gamestop. (With SCL coming out you would think we would see some displays in these shops along with TV ads.)
4: Ads in comic books or magazines.
5: Ads on gaming sites. (Only one I've seen is for Fantasy Grounds).

Where is this media storm from D&D that has dominated the scene?

Mearls was talking about social media. Facebook, Twitter, and Reddit. Social media is a bigger market device for something like 5E than the mainstream. Every company is trying to market through social media. Mearls is intent on using social media to push 5E, not mainstream media. D&D5E got a huge push on social media this time around.

I see you acknowledged this upthread. Social media is bigger than the regular media now. You can get a notice on Yahoo or some other news by trending on social media. It's a better and cheaper marketing tool for something like D&D at this point. D&D is never going to be mainstream. Why would a Mearls be talking about anything other than the market channels that reach the largest portion of their market?

 

[Celtavian]

I don't understand what 'media sphere' Mike is referring to here. D&D has zero presence in the general media. There was some note of the release of 5e and the idea that 2014 was the 40th anniversary of the release of D&D, but beyond that it sunk back into obscurity like every other edition of the game has since the end of the days of the religious wing-nut thing in the 80's.

Now, if they can actually release a notable mainstream movie with the D&D name on it? That would garner some attention to the brand, and clearly you'd like to coordinate that with the release of material for the game, video games, etc so as to get maximum impact. So, fair enough, but I'm not sure I see how that relates to no indication whatsoever that there's really even any rules material in the pipeline.

Clearly if the D&D house starts to look dark and boarded-up people will move on. Its great that a big surprise bash will be thrown there sometime, maybe, but people won't wait around. There's such a thing as anticipation too.

He meant social media. It has an extremely strong presence on social media amongst fans of this type of game.

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

As for what the success of D&D will look like in the future, 3 to 4 years from now... well that's what this thread is about. That's what Mearls is grappling with in these tweets. It's fairly clear that WotC needs a to steer a different course than they have in the past, as no edition has exhibited particular sales success for more than 3 to 4 years.

I think its abundantly clear where they are at. They've internalized the Pathfinder lesson, and they hope they are just being a better Paizo at this point. "Its all about story story story", which is nice, but this is what they were told years ago, when PFs APs started wiping their arses. But they've taken it to an extreme. Its a real question if that's a good idea or not. They never liked the sales of splat books, and so they've abolished them. The magazines clearly took up a lot of time and energy that they seem to want to deploy elsewhere. Nothing about any of what they're doing is mysterious at all. I'm not convinced it has much to do with edition though.

 

[Celtavian]

I think its abundantly clear where they are at. They've internalized the Pathfinder lesson, and they hope they are just being a better Paizo at this point. "Its all about story story story", which is nice, but this is what they were told years ago, when PFs APs started wiping their arses. But they've taken it to an extreme. Its a real question if that's a good idea or not. They never liked the sales of splat books, and so they've abolished them. The magazines clearly took up a lot of time and energy that they seem to want to deploy elsewhere. Nothing about any of what they're doing is mysterious at all. I'm not convinced it has much to do with edition though.

Do you even like Pathfinder or 5E?

 

[SigmaOne]

I'm not going to quote each thing so I will number it.

1: This is why I want to know what the plan is. If the plan is to only release two AP's a year then I am gone. I will find another game to play that gets more support and stop wasting my time waiting for something that is never going to come.

2: So one game that has no ads on TV what so ever will suddenly bring it all back in full force? That's a lot of wishful thinking. The presence is not strong, it's probably the same as it has been for the last 15 years. D&D has never faded away because there has always been a new edition to keep it alive. There is nothing being done now that hasn't already been done so acting like 5th edition has broken new grounds or has caused a surge in D&D's popularity is a myth. You hear more about it now because of how common and easily accessible social media has come.

1: I agree; I'd love to know what the plan is. I'd love to hear more about what they're working on. Frankly, I don't see why you're waiting when you should just be enjoying yourself with the many other good options for entertainment, if 5e is currently not such an option. Either what you want comes, and you can worry about it then, or it doesn't and you haven't wasted your time.

2. What do you mean by "bring it back in full force"? What and when was full force? What do TV ads have to do with it, especially for a game three months from release? You really think there's no buzz for a game when numerous gaming news outlets, including some of the largest, such as IGN, give it "best in show" awards?

I'm hearing the same voices that said 5e would be a big flop, because they didn't see what they wanted from the playtest... those voices were proved resoundingly incorrect with the release of 5e. [Edit: I want to rephrase that -- the voices I'm hearing now *sound* like those that claimed 5e would be a flop at the offset. And to be clear: it is not. The books provided are a complete game that will give many, many people years of entertainment, as others have already explained.] It might not have what you and your friends want at your table, but it's a very popular product. I think the same people who were wrong then are still wrong now, and that's why I don't trust the doom and gloom you're selling. I'm sorry you don't like what you see; like I said, I hope in the future you see more that you like from 5e, but if not, there's no reason for you to waste your time waiting for a horse to turn into a camel. They're different beasts and they (likely) always will be. Might as well play a game you enjoy now. I do hope that we see more of WotC's plans, and at the very least, you and those in your position can have either some satisfaction or release.

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

Do you even like Pathfinder or 5E?

I don't think there's a simple answer to that. I'm not sure what bearing it has on the discussion at hand. I've played D&D a lot, for a long time. I've never really been that big on 'disliking' things. I've never played PF, wasn't very excited by 3.x in general, but I think the specific game, the table, is far more interesting a question than the version of D&D that is in use. Likewise with 5e, its not my most favorite D&D, but again, so what?

 

[DEFCON 1]

You all know the plan. It's already been told to you. It's been the same since the beginning. Nothing has changed, so there's nothing you need to wait for. So for Pete's sake, crap or get off the pot already.

 

[S_Dalsgaard]

You all know the plan. It's already been told to you. It's been the same since the beginning. Nothing has changed, so there's nothing you need to wait for. So for Pete's sake, crap or get off the pot already.

I have a feeling that many people simply cannot fathom, that WotC would take a strategy so far from what they themselves consider an obviously better one (i.e. releasing plenty of splat books to make a quick buck). They keep waiting for the "just kidding, of course we will release 10 books per year as usual" announcement.

 

[SigmaOne]

I have a feeling that many people simply cannot fathom, that WotC would take a strategy so far from what they themselves consider an obviously better one (i.e. releasing plenty of splat books to make a quick buck). They keep waiting for the "just kidding, of course we will release 10 books per year as usual" announcement.

In their defense, it's also somewhat unfathomable in that it has always been the strategy before. And it's reasonable that such a significant change in strategy would lead many to believe that WotC has gone "off course and into the weeds".

 

[Mistwell]

And 4e was equally up there in the 4e days.

Uh, no it wasn't (not even close). But really, after you said WOTC is trying to kill D&D and ceded the market to Paizo, I think this conversation exceeded the silly quotient.