Monster Manual: What details?

[Kynn]

There's just one detail that I want monster stat blocks to have:

% Liar

You want to know how dishonest the monster is?

 

[Klaus]

Because sometimes you don't want to 'name' the mosnters and by providing a descriptions you can set up atmosphere and mood whereas a monster illustration pretty much gives it away after the first time.

Eh.

I prefer to show an image to the players and say "this is what you see". And when coming up with illustrations as an artist, I tend to push for illustrations that can be used in-game.

 

[Hassassin]

Why wouldn't you show the picture?

Pictures are so easy to remember that anyone who's paged through the MM will know most of them from the image.

Also, it doesn't really work when you have e.g. female vs. male monster, ancient vs. young dragon, 5 vs. 12-headed hydra etc.

 

[Klaus]

Pictures are so easy to remember that anyone who's paged through the MM will know most of them from the image.

Also, it doesn't really work when you have e.g. female vs. male monster, ancient vs. young dragon, 5 vs. 12-headed hydra etc.

Most of the humanoid creatures in the MMs have male and female versions in the same image. Dragons don't change much, but you can say "it's a younger version of this creature". "It's a creature like this, but with seven more heads!!!!!".

And if the players know the creature's image, is that really a problem? I understand in Ravenloft, where the whole point of the campaign is to emphasize the horror of the unknown. But in the average setting, the PCs live in the same world as entire civilizations of those creatures. If we, on Earth, have folklore detailing how to recognize certain creatures that don't even exist, imagine what sort of knowledge will be available in a world where they *do* exist.

 

[Hassassin]

And if the players know the creature's image, is that really a problem? I understand in Ravenloft, where the whole point of the campaign is to emphasize the horror of the unknown. But in the average setting, the PCs live in the same world as entire civilizations of those creatures. If we, on Earth, have folklore detailing how to recognize certain creatures that don't even exist, imagine what sort of knowledge will be available in a world where they *do* exist.

Like in our folklore, the things they "know" about any but the most common threats may vary a lot. Using the 3e Knowledge rules, untrained characters have no chance to identify monsters they haven't dealt with before. But this is a campaign issue.

 

[Aeolius]

Using the 3e Knowledge rules, untrained characters have no chance to identify monsters they haven't dealt with before.

Yeah, that needs a little work. Realistically thinking, how many people have personally encountered a cobra, whale shark, panda, or jaguar? Yet all of those creatures are easily identified, because of learned knowledge.

 

[Hassassin]

Yeah, that needs a little work. Realistically thinking, how many people have personally encountered a cobra, whale shark, panda, or jaguar? Yet all of those creatures are easily identified, because of learned knowledge.

Would any of those have been identified by medieval knights?

 

[Lurks-no-More]

People who complain about 4e MM should check out the Essentials Monster Vault, and Threats of Nentir Vale.

Great books, with mechanically solid and interesting monster designs, great artwork, and tons of interesting fluff, adventure hooks and other lore.

For example, the Manticore entry mentions that they shed their teeth like sharks; that the image of such teeth is sometimes used as a generic "Warning! This place's dangerous!" sign; that some people consider finding a manticore tooth an ill omen (no doubt because it suggests there are manticores around!) or a sign of bad luck, to the point that sometimes folks who find them don't mention their discovery lest they be shunned as unlucky... which doesn't help when the beasts attack!

Both of those books beat every 3e monster book with both hands tied behind their backs, and IMO are just as good as the (justly) famous 2e Monstrous Manual.

 

[Aeolius]

Would any of those have been identified by medieval knights?

Fair enough. But in medieval fantasy wouldn't orcs, goblins, and kobolds be nearly as common as the boar, deer, and wolf? A D&D knight would be well trained in the manner of monsters he or she might encounter, before setting foot in their first dungeon.

Even the commoners would know a handful of beasties, passed down parent to child in the form of nursery rhymes, fireside tales. and lessons.

Everyone knows about fire-breathing dragons. It's when that dragon turns out to be a benign benefactor that things turn interesting.

 

[Nebulous]

http://www.kenzerco.com/free_files/owlbeast.pdf

Check that out, it is the best monster book ever released, maybe the highest qualtiy of crunch and fluff I have ever seen

But, as I said on RPGNet, the Nentir vale level of info would be good.

I agree that the book by Kenzer is amazing, truly an amazing monster manual, but the level of detail might be TOO much. Still...I want that book just to read it.