Monte's secret project confirmed

[Lady Dragon]

So is this how its going to be from now on every time WoTC does anything even remotely similar to a D20 comapny they are going to be accused of copying sombody.

First of all there is only so many topics out there.Second WoTC take two years to put out a product some of the D20 comapnies can do it 6 months and finally The Evil book was hardly up to the standards of WoTC and Monte Cook.

So saying they are copying Evil is ridiculous.

 

[Derulbaskul]

... I was really more interested in the prostitution, slavery, human sacrifice, and other mature themes. A book that adresses adult themes in a mature manner is something that has not been done before and is lacking throughout the d20 multiverse. How prostitution works, and slavery, alternate justice and honor codes, sexual relations among races, etc, within a strange world where magic is common and the gods talk would be a really intesting book. And very useful...

Interesting?
Useful?
Mature themes?

Sorry, I have to disagree there.

Try working, living and travelling in Asia and the Middle East and see what havoc these "mature themes" wreak on the lives of real people. Yes, it's only a game, but there are some things from real life that I would prefer were also left out of the game.

So rather than by a book that treats these things as crunchy bits for a game, try travelling around Asia and see these things "up close and personal". And if you want to see all of them at once, I can send you the names of a few islands in Indonesia.

Oh, and then decide whether you really want a book of d20 stats for these things.

NB: And yes I know it is only a game (and yes to all the other arguments that a variation on this same theme). However, the line has to be drawn somewhere.

 

[Maldur]

For some reason I can only think that the "secret monty-threads" are now changng into "hunting for vile october threads"


okok "I" thought it was funny

 

[rounser]

However, the line has to be drawn somewhere.

This reminds me of King Stannis's opposition to including drugs in D&D. IMO, the issue is a conundrum, so to think it through...

I can understand viewing inclusion of real world horrors into a game as being in bad taste in the same way as telling a joke about slavery could be construed as being in bad taste, but beyond that...? Far worse horrors are in novels and movies, yet they are an accepted part of our culture.

The mental hurdle seems to be that popular media can cover slavery, prostitution and drugs, but not an RPG, because it is different. Different, how?

I think the perceived difference is twofold:

The first problem is, IMO, in the idea of "playing a game" with the idea. By definition, including such things in a game is for reasons of creating "fun". But, the thinking must go, these things aren't trivial and are abominable rather than fun, and they are made trivial and turned into a source of fun by inclusion in a game.

The second problem I see is that we trust the popular media to treat the subjects with a certain minimum level of respect - there are publishers and censors to enforce this. In a game, there's no-one to stop you from mocking or trivialising the issue, or even revelling in it. The fear is that it will influence people's perceptions of the issue - maybe even turn them "evil".

But then again, we trust irresponsible people with "evil" subject matter (such as movies about murder) from popular culture, don't we? To have a different rule for RPGs is to state that RPGs are different, and are potentially more harmful than books and movies. Given that all three rely upon a world in the imagination, the only difference seems to be between playing a character versus watching or reading about a character. I'd hesitate to suggest that the difference is meaningful, but it could be.

A complex issue.

 

[kenjib]

F.A.T.A.L. r0xx0r5 j00!

 

[Humanophile]

Interesting?
Useful?
Mature themes?
...
Sorry, I have to disagree there.

Here's where I have to disagree. And while I don't think BoVD will really be as... Black Dog as the blurb claims, there will always be groups using rape, prostitution, drugs, slavery, and what have you in game. Some groups will handle them maturely and intelligently, some will have the party fight slavers instead of orc raiders occasionally, and some kids will giggle while playing stoners and acting like amoral psychopaths. The only reason I don't feel the need to see an official gaming suppliment on them is because I know how easy it is to get the non-crunchy bits from better places. (Well, that and I don't think WOTC can give them the depth a good documentary could, plus I don't think a "how truly sick some people are" suppliment would sell well, and it would turn off far more people than it could possibly entice.)

That said, there will be a need for crunchy bits on much of this stuff, and I'd much rather a respected, known company give pointers than let groups either giggle or scratch their heads. That way, at least I'll know that somewhere, someone's trying this in good taste, and that the penalties will outweigh the benefits in the long run.

 

[Harlequin]

That's what I would do. If I wrote a book called the Book of Vile Darkness.

Harlequin gives Monte a big HUG


And to those that are crying over the 'Evilness' of this book

Get over it...its a game...its roleplaying

Next you will want every movie thats been made about rape or murder or anything naughty taken off our screens...

Then the video games, then the Novels...

There are too many weak people that want to hide from the harshness and reality of the world...The world is a brutal place, always was and always will be...

If you cant handle it...go and play Nintendo


Harlequin

 

[MythandLore]

Oh, and did I mention that the "monsters" that I'd put in there would include all the major archdevils and demon princes? And their various minions? And those that revere them almost like gods?

Finally!!!
For gosh sakes!!!
(When will you post a list of said "monsters"?)

I could see myself buying such a book.

 

[Frostmarrow]

My question is can you wear sentient squids on your head...

Eh... Sure you can:

 

[Eternalknight]

I want the book.

It won't do much for D&D's image (see the What Made D&D Evil Thread). That could be one downfall.