Monte's secret project confirmed

[Upper_Krust]

Hi Psion!

My question is can you wear sentient squids on your head.

There was a picture in the 2nd Ed. Mega-Adventure Night Below (Book 3, page 19) of a man wearing a Mind Flayer as a hat!

 

[Upper_Krust]

Meant to add, of course I am buying the Book of Vile Darkness!

Keep up the good...I mean evil, work Monte!

 

[Numion]

Let's see how the BoVD compares to AEG's Evil before we jump to conclusions, shall we?

I'd be pissed if WotC didn't cater to players who want this sort of elements in their games. We're consumers and can decide to support the better product. Evil is so inherent in D&D games that it would be folly for WotC not to do such a book. It's not ripping of anyone; I bet the idea for BoVD was hatched before AEG's Evil.

 

[Orclicker]

This looks interesting but I can't wait for Kenzerco's Villain Design Handbook!

 

[Zarrock God of Evil]

Let's see how the BoVD compares to AEG's Evil before we jump to conclusions, shall we?

I'd be pissed if WotC didn't cater to players who want this sort of elements in their games. We're consumers and can decide to support the better product. Evil is so inherent in D&D games that it would be folly for WotC not to do such a book. It's not ripping of anyone; I bet the idea for BoVD was hatched before AEG's Evil.

Yes I'm sure it was. In addition things such as many of the Demon Princes and Lords of the Nine can only be printed officially in a WotC product so if they are truly included I can't wait to see this product (and I don't own Evil and have no plans of buying it either)....

-Zarrock

 

[Psion]

That's what I would do. If I wrote a book called the Book of Vile Darkness.

(Wipes bead of sweat of brow)

Now that sounds cool/useful. This "mature take" spin sounded a little dubious.

THKS!

 

[Psion]

Get over it...its a game...its roleplaying

Next you will want every movie thats been made about rape or murder or anything naughty taken off our screens...

So, if Hollywood is doing it, we should follow in step? You'll excuse me if I fail to recognize Hollywood as a good role model. Many hollywood movies suck on ice, and more and more directors are resorting to lame-o shock tactics. Happily, our lot is not cast with Hollywood.

That said, bringing the depravity of the world to your gaming table does not seem to be the premise. Happily.

There are too many weak people that want to hide from the harshness and reality of the world...The world is a brutal place, always was and always will be...

If you cant handle it...go and play Nintendo

Bite me; I'll roleplay how I like and don't appreciate your condascending attitude nor your pretenses that if I don't like your way of roleplaying I should "go play Nintendo".

Here, let me create the mirror statement: If you want depravity, go watch a snuff flick.

 

[King_Stannis]

This reminds me of King Stannis's opposition to including drugs in D&D. IMO, the issue is a conundrum, so to think it through...

rounser, are you sure that was me? in the past i've shyed away from running groups of evil PC's, and i think that it gives critics of the game more ammunition when players are evil (just my opinion).

but i'm gonna have to say that you have me confused with someone else. the corner "black lotus" dealer is a staple of my campaign. i don't think i've ever said drugs should be excluded from the game.

 

[drnuncheon]

Interesting?
Useful?
Mature themes?

Sorry, I have to disagree there.

Try working, living and travelling in Asia and the Middle East and see what havoc these "mature themes" wreak on the lives of real people. Yes, it's only a game, but there are some things from real life that I would prefer were also left out of the game.

Ever killed a goblin, cultist, dragon and taken their treasure?

Murder, robbery, and genocide also wreak havoc on people's lives. Isn't it a bit of a double standard to think that that sort of thing is OK, and drugs and prostitution aren't?

J

 

[Psion]

Ever killed a goblin, cultist, dragon and taken their treasure?

Murder, robbery, and genocide also wreak havoc on people's lives. Isn't it a bit of a double standard to think that that sort of thing is OK, and drugs and prostitution aren't?

Uh, so? I think you might be misestimating people's level of objection to such details in a game. Hell, if you know my Mongoose reviews, you know I have a conservative strain. I don't pretend to speak for everyone who has issues with so-called "mature themes". But I can tell you this much: regardless of the depth of treatment I give them, drugs and prostitution exist in my world. It's just realistic and a fact of life. Further, I have had games than have featured such NPCs. For example, one of the more interesting role-playing scenarios I ran in my first 3e campaign was where the PCs ousted a cell of a criminal syndicate working in the village. Further, one PC helped defend a prostitute against an abusive customer. As is the case with many adventurers, to the outside observer they may seem a bit like criminals themselves; the fact that the PC defended the prostitute against an abusive customer only helped cement that image. The prostitutes that reported to the criminals in question decided that the PCs were the "new bosses" and started paying them protection money. Which gave the PCs an interesting conundrum.

So am I ignoring drugs and prostitution? No, not at all. These are bona fide sicknesses of society that aren't as easy to kill as a simple demon, and can make for challenging and interesting scenarios. Does that mean I want to play FATAL or pick up the d20 guide to unlawful carnal knowledge? Hell no. That kind of thing strikes me as antics of sexually frustrated teenagers (which is why I put "mature" in quotes.)

Fortunately, what Monte seems to indicate is that this isn't what the product is about. From all appearances, it gives you more tools to make despicable bad guys. If it done tastefully (as Armies of the Abyss was, which had some sexual content), then I won't take umbrage with it. Overcoming what is worst in the world is what the game is all about. For me, at least.