Most overrated "broken" things?

[Imp]

I've said this before, it's not so much that the spiked chain is implausible, it's that it's implausible and it's become standard equipment for a certain kind of fighter in the game. It isn't overpowered, but like the greatsword and longbow it's top-of-the-class for its role and so it becomes a centerpiece of the game and therefore not so extraordinary.

What do you mean, the baron's elite guard use guisarmes? Why?

It is also true that most all other exotic weapons are to varying degrees lame and weak.

 

[Slaved]

I would rather have a character use a spiked chain than the dwarven warpike.

 

[Tetsubo]

Change the text and take the spikes off the spiked chain and you are good to go as well.

With the Dire Flail all I have to do is change the text. The mechanics remain the same.

With a Spiked Chain I would need to change the weapon type from Piercing to Bludgeoning.

I prefer the former over the later.

 

[Tetsubo]

...unless the wielder was extraordinary. You know, a warrior who is highly unusual or exceptional or remarkable.

How skilled the warrior in question is is pointless. The weapon itself is absurd.

 

[Tetsubo]

I find all this talk about the spiked chain funny. Granted, the D&D spiked chain is not exactly real life usable. But I really want someone to fire of a single magic missle before I listen to that argument with much belief! D&D isn't about reality so much as it is having fun. If I have a player who wants to use one in a game because it'll make his character more enjoyable, I'm certainly not going to say no! I mean, the weapon itself is really not that strong, and certainly not completely worth that exotic feat it takes.

Of course, as long as we're talking about odd things that shouldn't make sense bu we play with them anyway ... let's talk about spiked armor! Come on. They way spiked armor would really be seen by an enemy is with excitement. The spikes essentially provide a guide for your blade to ensure a hit! And that's not even talking about the potential damage that a set of spiked armor would exact upon the armor wearer's assistant and fellow combatants when fighting in tight quarters. Or all those climb and jump checks that certainly a player in spiked armor should be worrying about. I don't find the spiked chain nearly so offensive to my realism than D&D's concept of spiked armor! But then again, if a player wants a set of spiked armor in my game because it helps them enjoy the game, I think that is a small enough compromise that I as a DM am willing to accept. Spiked armor (and all the real life problems that D&D ignores) is not going to ruin my game.



And really, that is at the heart of this thread, isn't it? Isn't this thread at least partially about what parts of our not-real-life-because-its-only-a-game fantasy can we accept? It is a game ... to me broken means it destroys the game. Broken brings the game to a halt until the broken aspect is resolved and brought back in line. But that's just my definition.

In that light ... spiked chains, monks, VoP, psionics, etc do not make my game come to a halt. They do not destroy my gaming experience. To be honest, they enhance it and I am better for them because their inclusion doesn't break my game and it means that my players enjoy the possibilities not involved in other games.

Last time I checked, Magic Missiles weren't usable in the real world. But then a Spiked Chain wouldn't be either...

And a Spiked Chain in my campaign WOULD destroy my gaming experience. It would be an insult to thousands of years of warriors developing the best possible weapons for the task at hand. Lives were spent earning that knowledge. To introduce such a blatantly absurd weapon is insulting to them...

 

[Thurbane]

Fighters are used to that feeling. They're the class right next to Druid, remember?

To be hosed by a shapechanging spellcaster is one thing; for a fighter to get hosed at fighting by another warrior-class, that's just salt in the wound...

 

[The Blow Leprechaun]

How skilled the warrior in question is is pointless. The weapon itself is absurd.

This is why I didn't want to go down this road. You've been shown time and again why it's not absurd at all within the confines of the game, and yet you still insist that it is. The world of D&D is not like our world, the people in it are superior to us. Just because you, or I, or anyone in history, could not have controlled a spiked chain weapon does not make it impossible for someone from D&D. And anyway, it wouldn't be that difficult to reel it back in. You don't have to grab the ring itself, you grab the interior length of chain (which, per the PHB, is not spiked), and slide outward to the ring.

What's that you say? That's the exact mechanic used to reel in many other chain-based weapons? Why, so it is!

Sorry to be snarky, but it seems all you keep saying is "it's absurd," when each and every area where you've said it doesn't make sense, it has been shown to make sense.

 

[Nonlethal Force]

Last time I checked, Magic Missiles weren't usable in the real world. But then a Spiked Chain wouldn't be either...

And that's my point!

Using a spiked chain no more offends my sensibilities than using magic. Because in fantasy, it doesn't have to be about sensibilities! It's about what makes the game fun.

Of course, we all have our limits. Nobody has the right to tell you what is allowed or disallowed at your gaming table. But likewise, nobody has the right to tell other people what is sensible otr not for their own table. That's why they're called DMs!

It would be an insult to thousands of years of warriors developing the best possible weapons for the task at hand. Lives were spent earning that knowledge. To introduce such a blatantly absurd weapon is insulting to them...

See, I don't see the offense more than other areas, personally. Actually, I think it far less offensive to sensibilities than magic. The spiked chain to the thousands of years of warriors is far less aggressively offensive than magic is to all the herbalist and shamans throughout the world. After all, at least a spiked chain could be constructed and hung on a wall and displayed, even if it is only a ceremonial instrument and not actually usable. Like the spiked chain only more greivous, D&D magic takes a legitimate knowledge of herbalism, magneticism, and healing - and mutates it into something destructive and powermongering. [Or, at least it can.]

Yet, people have no problem suspending the offense to shamans and legitimate herbalists (such as the historical Merlin or Aesclepius, to use two specific historical examples]. We do it all the time, because we choose to. We want magic in the game - even though it far more offensively distorts the legitimate practices that it represents than does the spiked chain.

I'm not saying you have to include the spiked chain. Just understand that decision as your inability to suspend reality in that area. It isn't a problem with the game, it's your choice! [And we all make those choices, so I'm not trying to say that there is anything inherently wrong with that choice, either.]

 

[shilsen]

And a Spiked Chain in my campaign WOULD destroy my gaming experience. It would be an insult to thousands of years of warriors developing the best possible weapons for the task at hand. Lives were spent earning that knowledge. To introduce such a blatantly absurd weapon is insulting to them...

I'm guessing that warriors over the last thousands of years are now either (a) dead and/or (b) completely unconcerned about what imaginary characters in your personal D&D game use.

But then I'm weird like that.

 

[Caliban]

Last time I checked, Magic Missiles weren't usable in the real world. But then a Spiked Chain wouldn't be either...

And a Spiked Chain in my campaign WOULD destroy my gaming experience. It would be an insult to thousands of years of warriors developing the best possible weapons for the task at hand. Lives were spent earning that knowledge. To introduce such a blatantly absurd weapon is insulting to them...

Dude, take a few deep breathes and calm down. That much hyberbole can't be healthy.