Multiclass from paladin after 3rd level?

[Plane Sailing]

Nobody else has mentioned it, so I'll mention that one drawback is that compared to a straight cleric you will be three levels behind in gaining spells - you won't get your first 3rd level spell until 8th level (and that can hurt, believe me!)

You also miss out on some excellent paladin-only spells, in particular the wonderful "bless weapon" which you could gain access to as early as 4th level paladin. Who wouldn't want auto-confirmation of critical hits, eh?

 

[Quasqueton]

Thanks for the evaluations, folks.

One problem I foresee is the broad problem that many front-line characters with spellcasting abilities encounter - do you attack or cast?

I think I'm needed in the attack role. Any spells would be pre-fight buffs (if time allows) or post-fight heals.

Consider picking up Combat Expertise (if stats allow) to boost the AC to absurd levels.

Yep, got a 13 Int just for that option.

Care to give us your stats?

Str 14, Dex 10, Con 14, Int 13, Wis 12, Cha 14. Currently wears chain shirt, but am saving up for full plate. Wields a greatsword.

Can you talk to the DM about losing the mount and getting something else in return?

We're sticking with the core books (mostly). I keep forgetting to check my DMG for the optional "mounts". Something like a big, sleek cat (leopard, cheetah) would make a better critter in an urban environment (where little to no riding is necessary).

Nobody else has mentioned it, so I'll mention that one drawback is that compared to a straight cleric you will be three levels behind in gaining spells - you won't get your first 3rd level spell until 8th level (and that can hurt, believe me!)

Well, if I stay paladin, that will still be the case -- only more so. I was thinking cleric because picking up cleric at 4th level gives more spells than picking up a 4th paladin level. And the turning ability is the same.

If you are focused on the roleplay aspect, which seems to be the case with maximized diplomacy, then the cleric option is probably better.

I've got to comment on this, my pet peeve. Playing a Diplomacy-twinked paladin is no more "roleplaying" than properly playing a 6 Charisma/20 Strength barbarian. Both can/should be role played, just in different ways.

(Ahem. Sorry 'bout that little outburst. Off to General to make a new thread on an old topic.)

Taking levels in anything other than cleric or paladin would be too much like abandoning his god. Paladin or cleric would be more "truthful" to this character, so I'm not really considering anything else.

Quasqueton

 

[Plane Sailing]

Don't forget your rate of gaining iterative attacks will also be slower.

 

[Darklone]

Wielding a greatsword.... oh yeah. Had an AC 13 paladin with greatsword for a while... she only survived due to horrible DM luck and divine intervention (in form of the DMs dice).

Divine Might doesn't look so interesting for you, Cleave neither... Go cleric. Pick up a shield sooner or later.

 

[Endur]

I would stick with pure paladin and not take cleric.

As others have mentioned, although cleric adds more spells, Paladin is one of those classes that gets much more effective the more levels you have of it.

Also, Paladin spells, the good ones, are more powerful than equivalent level cleric spells. Bless Weapon is probably the equivalent of a 2nd level cleric spell. Holy Sword is one of the best spells in the game (although not as powerful as the 3.0 version).

High level smiting rocks in combat. If you are in combat alot, I would pick up the feats Power Attack and Divine Might. They are awesome. If you plan to play on into Epic levels, Epic Smiting is one of the most powerful epic feats (possibly the most powerful epic feat).

Even if you hardly ever do wilderness stuff, the mount can be useful. For instance, you could brag in the tavern about your prowess in jousting tournaments (even if all the tournaments happen "off camera").

The more you mention the mount in role playing, the more likely the GM will offer opportunities for you to use your mount. You don't even need any mount "feats" or skills for it to be effective in combat. My favorite character Endur has 1 rank in the Ride skill, but his mount has saved him several times.

Also, the new 3.5 "summon mount" ability means you can summon the mount whenever you need it, including inside a dungeon. If your mount is a non-standard horse, i.e. for instance a Dire Wolf, this can be a quite useful summoning ability.

 

[Kalendraf]

I've got to comment on this, my pet peeve. Playing a Diplomacy-twinked paladin is no more "roleplaying" than properly playing a 6 Charisma/20 Strength barbarian. Both can/should be role played, just in different ways.

(Ahem. Sorry 'bout that little outburst. Off to General to make a new thread on an old topic.)

No offense taken. It was a poor word choice on my part. Everyone should roleplay. I think the wording I was looking for was something like "social skills" or "social engineering" as a way of communicating your way thru problems rather than other options like fighting, etc.

I agree you should probably only focus on being a Paladin or Cleric to stay true to your god. If you don't want to get the mount, then cleric seems ok as a follow-up. You can still be a viable front-liner that your party depends on, and continue to improve those diplomacy skills (class skill for cleric), but pick up a lot more spells than a paladin would. You might miss out on some paladin-only spells, but the wider cleric selection and more per day should more than compensate.

 

[Gaiden]

Your character suffer alot if you multiclass into cleric. Granted, the turning will remain the same and you will get more low level spells. However, you will no longer be able to operate as a front line fighter (well).

Your buffs no doubt would include divine favor, protection from evil, aid, eagle's splendor, and divine power. However, keep in mind the short durations of those spells - meaning that they will only be useful if you know about a combat ahead of time (which is far from always the case). Also, as a multiclass cleric, divine favor is always +1 behind in terms of its benefits.

All spells save divine power are accessable through the paladin whom has more hitpoints and a better attack bonus to begin with. The minor benefit to will saves with the cleric can be compensated for by increasing your charisma. There are no two ways about it, if you want to be a frontline warrior, stick with paladin.

On another note, your charisma is only 14 - you may not be terribly interested in divine might. Also, I have found that I rarely get to use power attack as a paladin because while the paladin has a good base attack bonus, he has nothing like the fighter or barabarian in terms of boosting the attack bonus. Also, if you go the route of combat expertise, I can promise you that you will never get to use both it and power attack enough to justify taking power attack if you are not on the road to divine might.

If you are uninterested in a mount, perhaps you are looking in the wrong direction - maybe you should go for a paladin PrC. I know S&S had a couple that were pretty good. I have not perused CW or CD enough to know what they contain, but you might find something in them as well.

 

[Endur]

Chr 14 and Divine Might

Charisma 14 is perfect for Divine Might. Granted, your character is only 3rd level. By the time your PC is level 20, Charisma will probably be:
14 +5 level ups + 6 cloak + 5 book = 30

A charisma of 30 means 13 Turn Undeads a day, means 13 rounds of +10 damage a day using divine might (free action).

This is awesome and makes up for the slightly less strength the average paladin has versus the average fighter.

Power Attack is necessary anyways for destroying objects like doors (hardness) and monsters with high DR.

 

[Ridley's Cohort]

On another note, your charisma is only 14 - you may not be terribly interested in divine might. Also, I have found that I rarely get to use power attack as a paladin because while the paladin has a good base attack bonus, he has nothing like the fighter or barabarian in terms of boosting the attack bonus. Also, if you go the route of combat expertise, I can promise you that you will never get to use both it and power attack enough to justify taking power attack if you are not on the road to divine might.

I have an 8th level paladin and I find that Divine Might is fantastic with my 20 Cha (16 starting, +2 from leveling, +2 item). It would not shift into the suck range if the Cha were 18. Even a 16 Cha would be useful.

As for Power Attack, I think it is quite viable for any character with a 2-handed weapon. One factor that is easy to overlook is highly campaign dependent: How often do you fight evil? Full PA + Bless Weapon against evil critters is a very potent combination that is easy to boost up. Full Combat Expertise + Full Power Attack + Blessed Weapon is a marvelous combo.

 

[Stormborn]

I know you said that you were going to stick to Paladin or Cleric so as to be true to your god, but have you considered Ranger? Also a divine spell user, and the character could be a kind of inquisitor, hunting down the enemies of the church. Take an evil outsider as your favored opponent. You could then eventually take the Knight of the Chalice PrC from Complete Warrior.

Otherwise, I say stick with pure Paladin. And since it is a "Standard" mount, ask your DM if you can have a Riding Dog. No level adjustments, you get it at the same time. You can explain it to your DM by drawing a parrallell between the dog's traditional qualities and the Paladins, loyalty,devotion, defender of the innocent, etc.