Multiple condition tracks?

[Sammael]

First of all, a disclaimer: I (1) like having a built-in "death spiral" type of thing in D&D and (2) prefer SAGA's condition track to the bazillion conditions in 3.x.

However, what's bothering me is that the condition track only covers physical penalties.

What about a condition track for the character's mental state - charmed, dominated, etc? I've seen several suggestions for "mental hit points" over the past few days, and I think this "Resolve Track" would be an easier solution. It would also make sense (IMO) with any future psionic rules, especially psionic combat.

Basically, you could have mind-affecting attacks which target specific points along the track, but also mind-affecting attacks which simply push the character further along the track. Furthermore, this could reduce the "all or nothing" nature of enchantments; for example, a failed dominate effect could still push the target one step on the track, perhaps so that he is in a charmed state. Not enough to break the target's will completely, but enough to weaken their resolve. I think there are plenty of precedents for this in D&D history - what with mind flayers and such often having to "break in" their thralls, before they become fully complacent.

So... what's your opinion? Is this too complicated? IMO, a good designer could make this idea work better than the various 3.x mental conditions.

 

[Aloïsius]

So... what's your opinion? Is this too complicated? IMO, a good designer could make this idea work better than the various 3.x mental conditions.

It's too complicated. Stun, charm, frightened, dominated... have nothing in common. There is no reason that a "fear" spell will allow the following "charm" spell to be more efficient.

 

[Sammael]

I suspect a 4E fear spell will just carry penalties with it instead of making the character run away. While having the party fighter run away from the dragon while soiling his armor provides some temporary amusement, it generally stops being funny after a round or two.

 

[Sun Knight]

I did toyed with this idea a while back in a d20 Modern campaign. I was carting the Wound/Vitality system from d20 Star Wars but I also wanted a third catagory that represented mental resolve and clarity. I had it be based on the Wisdom score, modified by the Charisma modifier.

Similar to the CoC Insanity mechanic each time something happen that caused stress, fear, or the like the Resolve pool lowers, and with it the character recieved penalties to his or her actions, Will saves, and whatnot. If the Resolve score dropped to 0 the character becomes almost catatonic. Of course the score replenished itself equal to the Wisdom Modifier, minimum of one, per hour of rest. Of course having the score drop to 0 have longer lasting effects such as phobias, mental illness and the like, but the characters can get psychiatric help. Also, using an action point immediately healed 1d6 worth of points.

 

[Aloïsius]

I suspect a 4E fear spell will just carry penalties with it instead of making the character run away. While having the party fighter run away from the dragon while soiling his armor provides some temporary amusement, it generally stops being funny after a round or two.

Argh... This "4e will be about fun and fun only" really scares me. Running away from danger is spectacular. Having a -2 malus is not.

 

[Sammael]

Argh... This "4e will be about fun and fun only" really scares me. Running away from danger is spectacular. Having a -2 malus is not.

Having a player sitting down doing nothing for 2 hours while the combat is finished or the cleric finds the time to remove his fear is hardly spectacular. If his character died, at least he could be working on a new character...

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

Argh... This "4e will be about fun and fun only" really scares me. Running away from danger is spectacular. Having a -2 malus is not.

On the other hand, I was playing in a game in which some fear-inducing enemies were hiding basically at the bottom of some stairs (and we had to get past them, somehow).

We spent way, way, way too many rounds of the game walkng down the stairs, getting frightened, running back up the stairs out of LOS, and waiting for the fear to calm down due to poor rolls.

It was funny the first time when the brave fighter was overcome and forced to turn tail and flee like a little girl. It was even funny the second time. The fifth time, however, it started to get old.

 

[Sun Knight]

That is why you don't use the stairs. You use a pickaxe and shovel to dig down to the location you wish to go and bypass the stairs completely.

 

[frankthedm]

I suspect a 4E fear spell will just carry penalties with it instead of making the character run away. While having the party fighter run away from the dragon while soiling his armor provides some temporary amusement, it generally stops being funny after a round or two.

Then he can run until LOS gets broken.

 

[Kae'Yoss]

Among the worst moments in RPG game sessions are those where my character was fleeing in terror (or otherwise totally incapacitated). In those moments, the game stops to be a game for me, I become a spectator to other people having fun, doing something, while I sit there (often in another person's home), without anything much to do. If I'll never be in a situation like this again, it will be too early.