My Alchemist core class

[gpetruc]

I've made an alchemist core class for a reinassance world where all the magic is in the form of alchemy.

you can look at the first draft here: http://digilander.libero.it/gpetruc/crystaldawn/Alchemy.html

I've also nearly finished the component list, and I'm beginning to assign to every spell its components. I've decided to have more than one formula for the same spell; for example there could be a variant that requires more components but less expensive ones, or one that requires expensive components but more easy to find than others and so on.

I'll post the excel spreadsheet with the spell list and component list if someone wants to look at it and maybe give me some suggestions.

Suggestions that would be particularly welcome are:
- some new components, expecially including acids and similar chemical things. I choosed to avoid monster body parts so that characters won't go around collecting nasty things thinking they might be useful later on.
- formulas for spells: what components to use for which spell
- suggestion on other spells to add (expecially from sources that are freely available)
- critiques and possible balance issues for the alchemist class

Thanks

Giovanni

 

[Turanil]

Well, the class seems complicated (and thus boring) to use with all these components. Also, it's not clear how they cast spells; can they "cast" as many spells as they want, once they know a formula?

Just by the way: the netbook of classes (volume 2) has published a core class of alchemist which is easy to use, but still convey the idea of having to use many different mixtures and material components to cast spells.

DOM

 

[gpetruc]

Thanks for the suggestion: I'll try to make it more simple.

I've looked at the NBoC Alchemist, but it's nearly a Wizard (same spellcasting mechanics) while I wanted something different. (it doesn't even have a chance of failure !)

The components are necessary as they are the only limit to the spells an alchemist can cast every day.

 

[Turanil]

The components are necessary as they are the only limit to the spells an alchemist can cast every day.

I understand that it would be cool to have a much different class, and as such, I am much interested to see it finished. However, if material components are the only limit to cast spells, I see a potential for abuse there: with a bag of holding full of appropriate components you could cast an unlimited number of spells per day. Now, even if GMs will see that this doesn't happen, they will have a hard time figure out to how many components they should restrict the PC alchemist.

In fact, I suggest something else: let the components become simple to handle and get by, being more flavor text than anything else. However, limit the Alchemist with casting time and DC checks. What I have in mind is the Sha'ir of the 2e Al'Qadim supplement (available as a 3e conversion on http://www.zakhara.com if I remember well...):
They could cast an unlimited number of spells per day (which were retrieved by their familiar), but to get a spell like this required 1d6 round + 1 round per spell level, and also had a percentage chance (50% base + 5% per caster level - 10% per spell level, or something like that). Maybe alchemists could do something like that. That is:
1) Components: let them have basic components easily, costing 5 gp per spell level (or something), but with mediocre chances of successful casting, or casting at -1d4 levels? Then, with more costly and difficult to find components (specific ones as in your list), they could cast their spells more easily and at normal spellcasting level.
2) Manipulating components would require a certain amount of time (see Sha'ir above), and require a check roll. That way, you cannot abuse the suse of spellcasting, even if theoretically you could cast as much as you want.

DOM

PS: would be glad if you reviewed or commented my magician and Istari classes...

 

[gpetruc]

I've started making the simplified version. I've cut down the component list (now 60), divided them by level, made the price and the chance to find them depending only on the level. With a proper sheet I think they shouldn't be too much to handle.

I'm also trying to reduce the bookkeeping time required and to write down the rules in a simpler way.

The main limits to spells per day are:
1) the components (there are no bags of holding as the alchemist is the only spellcaster and he cannot create them) both in price and expecially in the difficulty to find them (when at high level).

2) forumlas known: there is no fixed limit, but there aren't the two free spells/level and so they must be researched or copied from somewhere

2) two skill checks are required, one to prepare the spell and one to cast the spell. The DCs are so that to prepare and cast the maxium spell level is a 50% chance, and one 2 levels lower about 75%.

3) time to prepare components, and the fact that prepared components must be used before three days or they are ruined (this avoid an alchemist to create lots of components and then go around with them)

4) time to cast the spell: I'll raise it to 1d3 full roundsm, with a feat reducing it to 1 full round (but raising by one level)

5) the idea of casting with "generic" components when nothing best is available but at a lower power level and with a greater chance of failure is good; I'll try to put it in the rules.

I'll post the revised version as soon as I'll finish them (but I'll have some busy days of study now, and so it will probably be the next weekend)

 

[gpetruc]

Here is most of the simplified version of the class. I also tried to write down the explanatory parts in a clearer way.

http://digilander.libero.it/gpetruc/crystaldawn/simpalchemy.html

The component list is done (60 components) and I've made the generics: one for each spell level, greater cost, -2 to the casting check and cast at caster lvl - 1d4, but easier to find and only one doze of them is enough for every spell of that level (and maybe even for lower level spells).
I'll associate the components to the spells tomorrow and post the spell list and component list, maybe also in a character sheet form.

I've cut down the preparing time (now 5 min/level for low level alchemists, 2 min/lvl for mid an 1 min/lvl for high) so that in one hour an alchemist can prepare a good number of spells, but I made the casting time 1d3 full rounds (with AoO only in the last one) to reduce the number of spells he can effectively cast. A feat can reduce the casting time to one full round with a -2 to the check (maybe).

What do you think ?

 

[Jeph]

Nice. Very nice. I'm not completely sure about balance, but I love the flavor!

 

[Turanil]

Well, the class is better. Nonetheless, I have been thinking about a few things:

1) Potions: it seems to me that magical potions (or at least alchemical elixirs) are really the kind of things an alchemist produces on a regular basis. As such, I would have given to alchemists some bonuses (times, gp or XP reduction; or checks bonus) when creating them.

2) Spells: since this class replaces spellcasters in a world where magic is almost non-existent (did I remember well?), I would give them only spells that looks more like basic transmutations (lead into gold, maybe polymorph self, etc.), explosions (fireballs, etc.), pharmacy (cure diseases, cure wounds, etc.), body enhancements (bull strength, cat grace, etc.); but nothing which does look truly magical like a teleport spell.

Just a side question: since they are the only spellcasters, what other classes exist in your campaign world along fighters and rogues (I see with difficulty a barbarian in renaissance, except in the New-World). Will you use Duellist (someone else is creating one on this forum), a Demaguogue (I have been working on it, but it is unfinished: a sort of priest without spell, a manipulator and politician), ranger without spell (there are threads on that subject around), etc... Well, just my 2 cents curiosity.

DOM

 

[gpetruc]

I've updated the simplified alchemist again. the url is the same: http://digilander.libero.it/gpetruc/crystaldawn/simpalchemy.html

Now nearly all the rules are there, including the component list, a list of minor alchemical items (I've expanded the PHB list) and the item creation feats.

I've checked the spell list again to remove some "unlikely" spells such as Telepord, D Door and Scry that where left there for when the world was more magical. Now it should be better.

For the potions I'm unsure: maybe halve the production cost (both gp and XP) ?
They can already create potions for spells up to lvl 4 (cap raised by +1 also because healing spells are all raised by 1 level) with the normal feat and with another feat they can create potions up to lvl 7.

The Al'Qadim conversion site does not work well today (the "characters" link is broken) and so I couldn't look at their alchemist.

I've still to assign to every spell the components (150 spells --> long time !) but having divided the components by spell level should make this easier as there are only a maximum of 8 components for each level.

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Other classes in my world will be:
- fighter and rogue are always there
- a non magical ranger (still to write it, even if I've already looked around the web for some inspiration)
- a modified bard (the Artist) more skill-driven but that can still cast some spells (from a limited list) with very high Perform rolls.
(I've still to do all the rules, I've only the idea)
- Aristocrat: I've added bonus feats (mounted combat ones, some finesse fighting, skill bonuses and leadership) every 3 levels + leadership at lvl 7 and landlord at lvl 11, and the ability to take more than one leadership feat for more followers (but not cohoorts). They should now be a good PC class: less BAB and HP than fighter, but still many feats and some good skils.

I didn't want a Duelist core class, but I was considerin to make it up using a Fencing feat chain (see my other topic on the same board) but the one I made is too underpowered and so I'll have to write them again. In this way one could play almost a Duelist by choosing those feats as bonus ones for the Fighter or from the Aristocrat and have two possible swashbucklers (one more effective and one more refined).

The idea of the Demagogue is interesting (and fits well the setting). Could you please post it on these board or email me your writeup of that class ?

 

[Jeph]

- a modified bard (the Artist) more skill-driven but that can still cast some spells (from a limited list) with very high Perform rolls.
(I've still to do all the rules, I've only the idea)

Sounds quite interesting. Might I try my hand at this? I'll post another thread on it in just a sec . . .