My attempt at a ship

[SnowleopardVK]

Magic not withstanding...

One would assume magic would play at least some role in a magic-heavy setting though.

 

[gamerprinter]

Of course. But since I don't know the specifics of your setting, I am just explaining under real world historical circumstances only. I have no other way to measure the seaworthiness of a vessel, without knowing more about your world. Magic could definitely make all the difference.

I have magic in my world's too, but magic doesn't change physics of normal things (there's still teleport and other things where physics don't apply). So a ship being seaworthy or not is dependant on its construction and design. What specifics it can do with arcane assistance is otherwise independant of its normal seaworthiness. In other words, if a ship can't survive high seas, no amount magic is going to save from eventually foundering.

 

[SnowleopardVK]

Fair enough. It'd be far too time-consuming to explain all the details of a completely homebrewed world, so I'm just gonna go with "it's not the same as the real world" and leave it at that. If anyone asks, a wizard did it.

...And I just remembered that one of my future roommates who wants to join one of my games when she moves in is a sailor. I'm gonna get called out on my lack of ship knowledge for sure. -__-

 

[Friend of the Dork]

A schooner which is typically the smallest ocean going vessel during the period after Columbus, but still the Age of Sail, has a complement of 120. So a Caravel, while an earlier ship, was the closest to your crew size for an ocean going ship.

I used a Brigatine ship as the delivery vehicle for the adventurers in my Curse of the Golden Spear mini-arc for my commercial Kaidan setting. A brigatine has a crew of about 200 - and this too is a fairly small ocean going vessel.

Most ships of the Age of Sail have crews of 500 to over 1000.

Just for something for you to measure against.

You had a very small vessel, as far as ocean going one's are concerned.

Where do you get your numbers from? It seems to me, outside the realm of warships, 200 crew is fairly large. Note that Compliment and Crew are not synonymous - for example the USS Niagara launched in 1813 was a brig with a crew of 18 professional, 24 volunteer, but a complement of 155 including officers and marines.

This is a small vessel in naval military terms, but not in civillian ones, and most pirate ships would not be larger.

OP: I think you did ok, but it could help researching a bit before your next game. Don't be afraid to use your players' expertise either, might make it even more fun.

 

[gamerprinter]

I have a naval ship guide, but it doesn't break down the complement from crew, so maybe you are right, but it's the only resource I have to reference. It gives stats for many ships of the line.

 

[Friend of the Dork]

I have a naval ship guide, but it doesn't break down the complement from crew, so maybe you are right, but it's the only resource I have to reference. It gives stats for many ships of the line.

Well you could always check the www, despite everything there must be some accurate information out there.

Also, SotL are a different beast altogether - that's like basing what crews you need on a modern cargo ship to an US Super-carrier. A SotL could be an interesting base for an adventure or even a campaign, as it is essentially a floating town.

 

[gamerprinter]

Well you could always check the www, despite everything there must be some accurate information out there.

Also, SotL are a different beast altogether - that's like basing what crews you need on a modern cargo ship to an US Super-carrier. A SotL could be an interesting base for an adventure or even a campaign, as it is essentially a floating town.

Eh, its was ships of the line in the 18th century - I don't know how modern that is supposed be, except 18th century. They were British ships of the line, as well...

 

[Friend of the Dork]

Eh, its was ships of the line in the 18th century - I don't know how modern that is supposed be, except 18th century. They were British ships of the line, as well...

My point was only that Ships of the Line are a bad comparison for typical fantasy merchant/explorer/priate vessels. Wether you want 18th century ships in your fantasy game or not is a completely different issue.

There is no particular reason why a quasi-medival society could not have developed seafaring technology despite lacking gunpowder and other late medieval/rennaissance technologies.

Although of course SoTL are made to enable rows upon rows of gunports, which would be completely redundant in a world where archery and wizardry would be the norm in ship to ship combat.

In this case the older syle vessels such as Cogs and Carracks, complete with fore - and aft castles would be appropriate, in order to allow archers and war wizards to rain fire upon enemy ships.

You could probably also use inspiraton from Japanese Sengoku Jiday area ships, although not seaworthy were made to enable archery and boarding combat.

 

[gamerprinter]

The discussion was only about the size of the crew of a ship. I even agreed with the OP that a caravel was appropriate with the size of crew he used in his game, but felt that caravel was a bit small for ocean going ventures. That's got nothing to do with guns or how a ship is armed. Now referring to a SotL was just for reference on size of crew. Whether he uses, archers, ballistae, cannons, or laser beams certainly isn't part of the discussion and why you're bringing up I can't really say.

The SotL was just my frame of reference on size of vessels, having no other concerns regarding the technology on board a ship - this isn't what the discussion is about. I've used ship technology in games once in 30 years of gaming and even then, it was small issue. The term/phrase SotL refers to the existing main ships of a navy, in whichever period is being discussed. So its an appropriate term for the old Spanish explorers, the Spanish Main or a modern navy depending on which period is being discussed. It's not referring to just modern navies.

I mentioned a Brigatine in one of my adventures. Brigatines are ships that were part of the world's navies since the 16th century (which is fairly close to a caravel using naval time period - a difference of 50 years?). Really do we even know if the OP's comparative time frame as medieval, renaissance or any other specific naval period. We don't. I'm not trying to make assumptions here.

In a possible future adventure with my Kaidan setting, I was thinking of including a Japanese Red Seal ship, which is a cool bastardization between a Spanish Galleon and an oriental junk which saw use just between the time Portuguese having arrived in Japan, and Japan closing its borders - seeing use for perhaps 40 years.

In the end this discussion is going a bit farther then the intent of the thread, so I'm stopping right here. I think the OP got his answer - that's the only important thing (and its not altering how he played his game, as he isn't playing magic navy anymore - his campaign is over.) In your games, use whatever ship timeframe and technology that let's you have the most fun. Historical accuracy was never the issue, my point was only seaworthiness of small vessels versus ocean going craft.

Why I need to argue with you about it, I don't know (nor truly care - its not that big an issue).