D&D General My Problem(s) With Halflings, and How To Create Engaging/Interesting Fantasy Races

[PsyzhranV2]

It's not just the weight that is the issue, it's the leverage. A human couldn't reasonably use a twelve feet sword regardless how light it was.

Different species having differnt rules that reflect their unique qualities is a good thing. It's not an issue.

Guts and Cloud Strife would like a word with you.

 

[AdmundfortGeographer]

tl;dr - Halflings don't fill any important narrative purposes in the game (and even the ones that they do fill heavily overlap with more story-driving races). They exist just to exist, mostly because people like Bilbo/Frodo Baggins, and just aren't an inspiring character race. They're just "short people", and even the settings that try to make them matter fail to do so in a way that couldn't be at least as easy to emulate with one of the other similar races in the game that actually have story connected to their existence (gnomes connected to fey, humans being humans, etc).

Thoughts? Who agrees with me? Who disagrees with me? If you agree with me, are your reasons for agreeing the same as mine, or are they different. If you disagree with me, why?

The Birthright halfling was one of the most interesting takes on the halfling of any TSR/WotC setting, right up there with Dark Sun’s.

I use the Birthright halfling background to this day for my halflings.

 

[bedir than]

Innocence, Authenticity, Tranquility, friendship, just plain being comfortable and in harmony with one's self and surroundings are not things you fight for, nor are they particularly heroic they are the things people who only care about the immediate care about which tend to end up producing a population of "f you, I got mine" not necessarily a population of good people.

Complete and utter crap that disregards real lived experiences in favor of ignorance.

This is literally why significant portions of the military join the military. Serving others, protecting the tranquil, growing friendships are absolutely worth fighting for, worth dying for -- this is true throughout fiction and reality.

At this point the disconnect between literature, reality, and the actual words written here is so extreme I just cannot in good conscious comment in this thread any more. This has to be a work, rather than authentic debate.

 

[Minigiant]

what else do they do what other subraces ones who are more divergent, also can someone get them a cooler look than just small human.

Halfling in my new campaign are blessed by the goddess of chance, Lady Luck. Because of this halflings often run casinos, carnivals, and circuses. Halflings, due to their luck, are banned from most gambling establishments unless they display a visible bad luck charm. Halflings are the main sources for temporary good luck and bad luck charms. Generals and kings will pay for crates of halfling charms and rations before a campaign.

Halflings are banned from a lot of things because they are too lucky. The term "coinedge" is common because halflings often have to prove themselves that they are out of luck and thus flip coins on their edges until they can't before someone will deal with them serously.

Halfling of the underdark, the Fifties, harass Drow with their barrages of slingshots of lucky rocks made from stolen duergar and deep gnome gemstones.

 

[Neonchameleon]

@Mind of tempest you claimed:

I meant halfling do not seek to become interesting they have no goal beyond getting back home or do what has to be done to get back home.

And when asked why you keep repeating this nonsense you replied:

it is literally in the text of the halfling so that is what they are beyond a dry stat block.

Fortunately for everyone it is possible to look at what Halflings are actually presented as - there's a D&D Beyond entry for the halfling:

You appear to have only partially read the first sentence which states: "The comforts of home are the goals of most halflings’ lives:..." Note the word most. Which means not all and it means that they have goals beyond that. And if you had read the second sentence "others form nomadic bands that travel constantly, lured by the open road and the wide horizon to discover the wonders of new lands and peoples" which is a motivation - seeking to discover wonders whether in terms of lands or people.

We have not just one but five motivations given in the "Kind and Curious" paragraph. "Even adventurers among them usually venture into the world for reasons of community, friendship, wanderlust, or curiosity. ... Halflings are easily moved to pity and hate to see any living thing suffer." None of these are good motivations to become a dark lord but all of them are good reasons to become an adventurer and want to stop a dark lord even if it means not going home for years.

So there. Halflings have more goals than getting back home. You personally might not like them but those are all motivations.

And there is a core reason that halflings have a narrative space of their own but it's not one that can be covered by gnomes even if the space gnomes are in should be covered by halflings. And a reason why rock gnomes should be halflings and not gnomes.

The fundamental pitch of almost all the D&D races except halflings is "I'm cool and powerful and here's how." This includes the small but inherently magical gnomes. The pitch for halflings is "I'm an ordinary person, smaller, weaker, and less powerful than everyone around me, and easily overlooked. And I'm not going to let that stop me doing what needs to be done."

The central gnome pitch is, in most cases, undermined by gnomes being a separate species from halflings. "I'm small but magically mighty because I'm a gnome so everyone is going to know I'm magically mighty. And I'm a trickster who everyone can tell is a trickster by looking at me because I'm a gnome." The first one can be done roughly as well by halflings (always depending on stats); "I'm small but magically mighty and everyone knows I'm magically mighty because thanks to my cantrips my eyes always glow". And tricksters who are known as tricksters before they open their mouth have ... issues.

Halflings might not feature much in the deeds of the great or the good - but eliminating them would be like eliminating human peasants on the grounds they don't do that much either. (The rock gnome is an artisan type halfling). They aren't a race for DM worldbuilders but for specific types of players and characters.

 

[Neonchameleon]

Innocence, Authenticity, Tranquility, friendship, just plain being comfortable and in harmony with one's self and surroundings are not things you fight for, nor are they particularly heroic they are the things people who only care about the immediate care about which tend to end up producing a population of "f you, I got mine" not necessarily a population of good people.

Halflings have the virtue that deals with that. Community. And remember that friendship is core to military brotherhoods and both authenticity and being comfortable and in harmony to one's self and surroundings are the foundations of almost all civil rights movements.

 

[Mind of tempest]

The Birthright halfling was one of the most interesting takes on the halfling of any TSR/WotC setting, right up there with Dark Sun’s.

I use the Birthright halfling background to this day for my halflings.

can you define such lore?

Complete and utter crap that disregards real lived experiences in favor of ignorance.

This is literally why significant portions of the military join the military. Serving others, protecting the tranquil, growing friendships are absolutely worth fighting for, worth dying for -- this is true throughout fiction and reality.

At this point the disconnect between literature, reality, and the actual words written here is so extreme I just cannot in good conscious comment in this thread any more. This has to be a work, rather than authentic debate.

where do you live that people join the military for that? the only ones I met seem to be there for a stable income, some sense of purpose, education or they just want to fight.

This has to be a work, rather than an authentic debate what do you even mean by that?

Halfling in my new campaign are blessed by the goddess of chance, Lady Luck. Because of this halflings often run casinos, carnivals, and circuses. Halflings, due to their luck, are banned from most gambling establishments unless they display a visible bad luck charm. Halflings are the main sources for temporary good luck and bad luck charms. Generals and kings will pay for crates of halfling charms and rations before a campaign.

Halflings are banned from a lot of things because they are too lucky. The term "coinedge" is common because halflings often have to prove themselves that they are out of luck and thus flip coins on their edges until they can't before someone will deal with them serously.

Halfling of the underdark, the Fifties, harass Drow with their barrages of slingshots of lucky rocks made from stolen duergar and deep gnome gemstones.

that seems familiar has someone done it before? do they have any other major none luck gods?

@Mind of tempest you claimed:

And when asked why you keep repeating this nonsense you replied:

Fortunately for everyone it is possible to look at what Halflings are actually presented as - there's a D&D Beyond entry for the halfling:

You appear to have only partially read the first sentence which states: "The comforts of home are the goals of most halflings’ lives:..." Note the word most. Which means not all and it means that they have goals beyond that. And if you had read the second sentence "others form nomadic bands that travel constantly, lured by the open road and the wide horizon to discover the wonders of new lands and peoples" which is a motivation - seeking to discover wonders whether in terms of lands or people.

We have not just one but five motivations given in the "Kind and Curious" paragraph. "Even adventurers among them usually venture into the world for reasons of community, friendship, wanderlust, or curiosity. ... Halflings are easily moved to pity and hate to see any living thing suffer." None of these are good motivations to become a dark lord but all of them are good reasons to become an adventurer and want to stop a dark lord even if it means not going home for years.

So there. Halflings have more goals than getting back home. You personally might not like them but those are all motivations.

And there is a core reason that halflings have a narrative space of their own but it's not one that can be covered by gnomes even if the space gnomes are in should be covered by halflings. And a reason why rock gnomes should be halflings and not gnomes.

The fundamental pitch of almost all the D&D races except halflings is "I'm cool and powerful and here's how." This includes the small but inherently magical gnomes. The pitch for halflings is "I'm an ordinary person, smaller, weaker, and less powerful than everyone around me, and easily overlooked. And I'm not going to let that stop me doing what needs to be done."

The central gnome pitch is, in most cases, undermined by gnomes being a separate species from halflings. "I'm small but magically mighty because I'm a gnome so everyone is going to know I'm magically mighty. And I'm a trickster who everyone can tell is a trickster by looking at me because I'm a gnome." The first one can be done roughly as well by halflings (always depending on stats); "I'm small but magically mighty and everyone knows I'm magically mighty because thanks to my cantrips my eyes always glow". And tricksters who are known as tricksters before they open their mouth have ... issues.

Halflings might not feature much in the deeds of the great or the good - but eliminating them would be like eliminating human peasants on the grounds they don't do that much either. (The rock gnome is an artisan type halfling). They aren't a race for DM worldbuilders but for specific types of players and characters.

okay, so they are just tourist given that they hate to see living things suffer they would not want to kill the thousand and one things that want to kill or enslave them?

why would they even recognise a dark lord unless we are going for an 80's cartoon villain? had to stop what you can't recognise as wrong?

their premise is one note they are all Frodo or bilbo and honestly, that's kinda dumb where are the alternative? where are their paragons, their villains, where is their history? they just are and it tires me they are copy-pasted without bothering to remix them and survive more by luck and being twee than anything mundane or grounded.

the point on eliminating the halfling is they literally in all aspects can be replaced with a human peasant and nothing changes.

look I am not against a race that is small and wholesome but I want some world presence, some nuance and an image beyond a short human.

Halflings have the virtue that deals with that. Community. And remember that friendship is core to military brotherhoods and both authenticity and being comfortable and in harmony to one's self and surroundings are the foundations of almost all civil rights movements.

civil right movements also depend on great shared pain, determinism, leadership and a history of oppression which halflings lack they just sort of are.

 

[Faolyn]

halflings have no story things happen to them as what they love and care about dies around them they are sloth made manifest, the small reptile who has had its world defined by tragedy and the acts of thing vastly more powerful than it at least has more story the one-note hobbit rip-offs and a justification for valuing those things so highly.

Maybe I just haven't read the right stuff, but... what are the equivalent stories for humans, elves, and dwarfs? I honestly can't remember, beyond maybe that elves, when faced with such tragedy, withdraw from the world.

 

[bedir than]

where do you live that people join the military for that? the only ones I met seem to be there for a stable income, some sense of purpose, education or they just want to fight.

This has to be a work, rather than an authentic debate what do you even mean by that?

Your continual disregard for the statements of others, reworking them into some kind of poorly phrased question, seems to indicate that you have no regard for the writing of others on the topic. It is hard to believe that you actually feel these things because as people answer your questions you just ask the same question in the response.

Take the position where you claim that people don't join the service to protect their homeland. This is quite literally the tale of Frodo and his halfling friends; it is the fiction of Captain America and so many supers; it is the tale of Rand al-Thor at the start of Wheel of Time.

Duty and obligation to protect those values and people you love is quite literally why I joined the service voluntarily. Your hand-wavey dismissals seem to be a 'work' (an effort to gain online clout) because it is quite bizarre for you to quote people who have clearly laid out there position with what amounts to "nah uh."

 

[Rikka66]

....friendship, just plain being comfortable and in harmony with one's self and surroundings are not things you fight for

I think just about every shonen anime would like to have a word with you.