Natural Attacks for the forgotten...

[Uriel]

Several cases have arisen n games where someone wants to attack in a manner not listed as an official option.

Bites for humans,dwarfs etc...

I have ruled them as subdual damage with a D4 for Med,D3 for Small,D6 for Large etc...does this sound fair?

Likewise, their are many creatures with obvious bite ability,yet no listed attack. take a look at any picture of an Orc or Bugbear. Should these (fanged/tusked) attacks be normal damage?

Forgive me if this is more appropriate to House Rules.

-Uriel

 

[Zombie-a-GoGo]

That sounds good to me; I'd reference the bite damages listed for different creature sizes under the Half-Fiend template and reduce all those values by 1 die type. Which is pretty much what you've done.

 

[Darklone]

I remember to have read somewhere that these "improvised natural weapons" only cause 1 point of damage. Not sure though whether it was in some core books.

 

[dcollins]

Sounds like a normal unarmed attack to me. Subdual, 1d2 Small, 1d3 Medium, with all normal AOOs, etc. Although realistically a bite should be less effective than a punch, and the 1 hp damage actually seems very sensible.

 

[Coredump]

I have ruled them as subdual damage with a D4 for Med,D3 for Small,D6 for Large etc...does this sound fair?

-Uriel

So, you are saying that a human can bite, and do as much damage as a 12-18" blade? (Dagger)

I would make it D2, or just 1hp.

 

[MichaelH]

Your figures are higher than the normal unarmed strike for creatures of those sizes. A creature with no listed bite attack cannot bite effectively. At most, it should do 1 hit point of damage. A human is better off kicking or punching than biting.

 

[Plane Sailing]

Personally I would just use the basic unarmed combat damage die for all unnatural attacks (kicks, headbutts, bites etc). I'd only allow half strength damage on bites though.

FWIW I believe that even for humans a bite can be a very effective technique if you are being grappled by someone, as long as you can find a biteable bit of them

 

[Kemrain]

Having been bitten before, I can assure you that a bite is most certanly not dealing subdual damage. Though I'd assume that people biting were taking the -4 penalty for dealing a different damage type, as biting isn't an easy thing to do unless you're grappeling.

- Kemrain the Biter.

 

[jgsugden]

Sharp, pointy teeth, but no bite attack: the presence of sharp teeth and fangs does not make your mouth a weapon suitable for combat. That has as much to do with the body structure as with the structure of the mouth. If the teeth can not be 'aimed' correctly, they are useless as a weapon.

Even when the teeth can be aimed correctly (ie; a foe is covering your mouth with a hand), a creature with no bite attack that bites another creature should not deal real or subdual damage. Their attack form is not effective enough to deal damage.

Not only is this the rule, it also makes sense. Compare what a human bite can do to what a thrown knife can do. Tearing a little skin with a bite is not worthy of even a single point of damage. Do you think that your average person on the street will die from 4 or 5 human bites? Do you think it will knock them unconcious?

Perhaps a DC10 concentration check is in order (if something might be disrupted by the pain of being bitten), but beyond that, I'd not worry about a bite from a human except as a role playing device. If a young maiden happens to make a grapple check to escape from a burly guard that is holding her, you can explain it by saying she bit his hand then escape when he reacted to the pain.

 

[Ferret]

I agree that bites don't do much damage, not only are human teeth a bit to blunt, but the sharpest ones aren't long enough to get into the flesh. A realy accurate bite attack rule would have to involve called shots (Look at the film Bone collecter), Someone (a complete nutter) once bit me on my knee and it left no mark. A good rule would be that it does no damage but can still deal a crit of XdX damage.