Need a powerful evil spellcaster PC in the group and don't know what to get

[yuelric]

I'm planning to participate in a new campaign and I really need to get an evil spellcaster.
The issue here, is that this PC has to be able to deceive everyone and gain their trust (this can be done with skills) but it also needs to be able to fight agains the others PCs in the party in the future (rogue, warrior and warlord... not alone obviously but it needs to be strong).

I read a ton of warlock handbooks and it seemed like the star pact with high CHA is a great choice (for the skills), but it doesn't look like is fun to play (never played one so I really don't know). I really wanna know if there's a Wizard, Sorcerer or some other class build that goes well with all the CHA skills i'm going to get.

I think I'll need Bluff, Diplomacy, Intimidate and maybe Insight.

 

[UltimaGabe]

I played in a campaign where the DM did this exact thing- another player joined us after a couple adventures, and his character- a troubled young Warlock- went through a couple sessions with us. Then, one session begins and that player hasn't shown up yet, so we start without him... Turns out he's running late, and he shows up right as we get into the final encounter. Except it turns out the final encounter consists of US FIGHTING HIS CHARACTER. Apparently him and the DM had worked all of this out from the beginning of the campaign, and his character ended up being the BBEG for the rest of the campaign.

Anyway, what really helped him as a recurring villain was the fact that he was a Fey-pact Warlock- so whenever he dropped an enemy, he could teleport away. He ended the fight by killing two of us (one of which was me) and then teleporting behind an illusory wall that he knew of, but we didn't.

Because really, the threat of a PC group isn't that you might fight them, it's that once you do fight them, they won't stop following you until you're dead. So unless you plan on coming back to life somehow, you better have some sort of unstoppable escape plan.

 

[Amaroq]

The first thing that came to mind was the Infernal Pact Warlock, as kind of epitomizing "evil spellcaster"; you can win the PC's trust by playing it closer to morally ambiguous than evil at first.

UltimaGabe has the right of it, though: as soon as it becomes player vs player, you are supposed to lose .. so if you want this to be a recurring BBEG in the campaign, he needs an escape plan. Fey Pact can give him that teleportation, but so can the Lvl 2 utility Ethereal Stride or Lvl 3 encounter Otherwind Stride, Eladrin racial power, not to mention numerous magic items.

Incidentally, if he does TPK the party, he might be the sort that has developed just a little soft spot for them by adventuring with them, or feels that he "owes" somebody for saving his life in a previous encounter .. so its fairly legit to have him perform Heal checks instead of coup-de-graces and leave the party beaten but not killed. For this resolution, he takes off with whatever McGuffin the party were after, and possibly leaving a note explaining why they're still alive and warning them not to come after him. (I won't be as forgiving, or don't make me regret this, or you'll be too late ..)

For that to work most believably requires delicate foreshadowing: e.g., demonstration that that's his ethic, or a hint of romantic attraction to one of the other PC's, or even visible anger when one of the other PC's saves his life (because now he "can't" kill them, according to his ethic).

Incidentally, foreshadowing whatever interest will compel him to betray the party early on is key for making the p-v-p scene "fun" instead of just "oh, my DM and one of my fellow players are being jerks".

The best BBEG's are just barely understandable / sympathizable with.

If any of that isn't working for you .. ("supposed to lose? Hell no!!") .. then I'd recommend you really take a look at your motivations for this: p-v-p to-the-death is a good way to ruin friendships, especially if your party is more story-based and your friends have a strong attachment to their characters.

 

[yuelric]

Thanks guys, you really gave me a lot of good ideas about how to develop my character.
I think the Fey pact Warlock it's the best choice, for the skills and for the teleport thingy.
The only thing that sucks is the pact with the nature thing, maybe for roleplaying purposes my DM can make my PC a Warlock that uses demonic power (doesn't matter what pact).

My idea is to make a character that does everything to get what he wants, and he wants to bring peace to everyone in the world... in a non conventional way.
I don't want everyone to hate me and my DM, the idea is to give them a recurrent boss and maybe a final boss to fight against.

 

[Amaroq]

Sure - in my campaign anyways, we've ruled that all flavor text is non-canonical, so saying "I have made a pact with a demon that gives me the powers of the 'Fey Pact' class feature" would totally work in my world.

Your DM may vary.

Glad to hear the last bit - it sounds like your primary focus is to give the other players in the group a fun plot twist and a recurring villain to hate ..

.. its just worth having the warning in the thread as you're likely to inspire others!

 

[yuelric]

What class would you go with a Fey lock?

Half elf looks pretty cool, with the bonus to CHA and CON. Also it has Diplomacy and insight bonuses.

Thiefling seems like a nice choice but the bonus to INT seems pretty useless to me.

 

[Dire Human]

My idea is to make a character that does everything to get what he wants, and he wants to bring peace to everyone in the world... in a non conventional way.

If this is your backstory/motivation, it's really hard to go wrong with a Star Pact Warlock. Seemingly benevolent but silent beings in the night sky promise power and eternal peace in exchange for strange and random tasks that slowly begin to form a pattern in an unexpected direction. Perhaps their idea of "peace" is to turn everything into aberrant creatures to form a Far Realm hivemind, the destruction of individuality. Or maybe their eternal watching has determined that we're unworthy; your actions will bring "peace" by dropping the moon or summoning a world-ending monster, leaving everything a peaceful and silent wasteland. Unknowable intelligences can be a lot of fun if you spin their propaganda right, with a dash of good old fashioned mind manipulation.

If you'd rather play the Warlock's Infernal Pact, you have to remember one thing about 4th Editions cosmology: before Asmodeus ascended to godhood, he and his devils were once angels. Is there a splinter faction of devils that never wanted to be a part of the war and are just seeking freedom? Maybe they remember life as angels and are bitter, requiring your character's help to overthrow Asmodeus from the outside. Or, more likely, are they playing your character for a fool who'll fall for a sob story, eager to help out evil creatures who have supposedly "reformed"? Make it ambiguous, and the beliefs of the other players will come out; is your character the world's most dangerous chump, or are these angels legit and their characters are the bad guys for interfering with your mission? This route is sure to cause a lot of table talk.

The Fey Pact is the least likely route to result in your character thinking that's he's fighting for world peace; the fey kings and queens are powerful, but not on the level of the previous patrons. But what if the Fey aren't going to usher in peace, but instead are preparing for war? Your character's actions could be the only thing preventing powerful fey from marching their armies into the World and claiming it as their own. Or, again, your fey patron could just be tricking you into jumping through hoops to keep you busy, sending you against a rival fey, or just because he or she is bored. I agree that the Fey Pact is the best for a pesky villain, mechanically; don't forget to Eyebite the last survivor so that he can't follow you.

Lastly, if your goal really is World Peace™, look into some of the evil Gods. Divine characters are spellcasters too, y'know. Are you keeping a deadly secret for Vecna, one that would destroy the world if made known? How about Torog or Bane, convinced that the world needs to be tightly controlled and every criminal punished before anything can be done?

Remember, this is all just roleplaying; nothing says you can't be a team player before you turn on the party. Just make sure that when your character does betray them, he or she is convinced that the others are working at cross-purposes and that this is the only way. That will make sure that even if there's an outcry, the other players will realize that it's all in-character and can't blame you, the player.