Need help with math justification.

[Stuntman]

I got a problem, sorta.

I happen to be a somewhat low stated cleric (16 str and wis).

I'd be interested in your full stats including powers. I play a fighter/wizard with 16 Str and 16 Int in my group. Although no one has a 20 attack stat, everyone has 18's except for the hybrid who also has 16's. The rogue and sorcerer in my group naturally outdamages me. I usually just set up flanking for the rogue or lock down the opponents. Overall, I end up helping the group net higher damage or take net lower damage due to my high AC and marking abilities. You don't see the big damage rolls, or see that a miss against you would have hit an enemy, but I do make a contribution even with my 16's.

 

[bganon]

Stats I have, if I remember correctly after racial is 16 13 14 10 16 12.
Going to get scale and scale spec at/by 11.

Eeeew, there's your problem. You're trying to have 3 mediocre stats in addition to STR+WIS. Drop CHA and INT and you could have 18 13 14 8 16 10 (or swap STR/WIS, or take 17 in both). I think 10 CHA is surprisingly playable for a Cleric, since so few powers make much use of it, and you've got no reason not to dump INT.

Basically, you're trying to play a dual-path Cleric and aiming for Dex-requiring feats. That's unorthodox. But a cool concept, you should go for it! Still, you probably ought to then focus on those three stats and accept lower scores in the others.

 

[Flipguarder]

Stats I have, if I remember correctly after racial is 16 13 14 10 16 12.

I don't mean to be overly harsh, but that is the worst stat allotment I have ever seen an actual character having. I mean you have NO 8. that is just irresponsible. You also put 5 points out of 21 in your main stat... Yeah... see if your DM will let you fix that.

I suggest (feel completely free to ignore)

after racials:

18 str
13 con
8 dex (can swap with int with no detriment)
14 int
16 wis
10 cha

If you are feeling real crazy you can go with a more extreme striker allotment


20 str
11 con
8 dex
10 int
16 wis
10 cha

 

[Akaiku]

I'd be interested in your full stats including powers.

Okay...

Longtooth Shifter, Cleric
Background: Forest Warden (Forest Warden Benefit)

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 16, Con 13, Dex 14, Int 10, Wis 16, Cha 12.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 14, Con 13, Dex 14, Int 10, Wis 14, Cha 12.


AC: 17 Fort: 14 Reflex: 13 Will: 16
HP: 30 Surges: 8 Surge Value: 7

TRAINED SKILLS
Religion +6, Insight +9, Perception +10, Nature +10, Athletics +10

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +2, Arcana +1, Bluff +2, Diplomacy +2, Dungeoneering +4, Endurance +3, Heal +4, History +1, Intimidate +2, Stealth +2, Streetwise +2, Thievery +2

FEATS
Cleric: Ritual Caster
Level 1: Hero of Faith
Level 2: Shifter's Agility

POWERS
Channel Divinity: Healer's Mercy
Cleric at-will 1: Astral Seal
Cleric at-will 1: Sacred Flame
Cleric encounter 1: Divine Glow
Cleric daily 1: Avenging Flame
Cleric utility 2: Life Transference

ITEMS
Ritual Book, Adventurer's Kit, Chainmail, Scythe, Tent, Camouflaged Clothing, Ruby Scabbard (heroic tier)
RITUALS
Gentle Repose, Fastidiousness

That help out a bit?

Note, it's not that my character is bad, its that me attempting to attack for damage seems subpar to not attacking...

 

[DracoSuave]

That is because what you're attacking with is itself subpar, and your feats are not geared towards damage, is all.

You're not dealing damage -only- because you're not doing anything to increase your damage, nor taking powers that deal damage.

That's all.

So first: If you want to do damage as a cleric, you need to do more weapon and less implement. Not only that, you're not supposed to be relying on your daily to -be- that damage. Avenging Flame is a -good- power for damage, but it's -by far- not enough (no daily is).

War Priest's Strike from DP will be a solid Encounter power. It's -really- good for piling on the damage onto one guy, and -everyone- loves combat advantage.

Righteous. Brand. All the at-will you need to know.

Strength and Wisdom are -great- places to put your points, having both high serves you well, seeing as Charisma boosts healing... but... Wisdom boosts it more.

Tho your Dexterity confuses and confounds me. (EDIT: Oh wait, Astral Fire and going for Foo Mastery at epic tier, maybe. Foo Mastery isn't really feasible for Clerics, most of the time tho, it -really- makes one of the least MAD classes into one of the -most-.)

Hero of Faith? A power that works in melee range with your sum total of... 1... melee daily power? -Really?!?- Weapon Proficiency: Something Good would serve you a -lot- better. Mordenkrad maybe?

Then when you have more powers and the 'balanced' aspect of your build starts to unfold, you can take a crusader's weapon (or another weapon that acts as a holy symbol for your faith) and weapon focus and Go. To. Town. with the implement powers.

 

[JiffyPopTart]

Alternately to changing you character into yet another combat guy, you could instead focus on making your character the "go-to" guy outside of combat. Spend feats on gaining skills and making yourself useful in that area and you might find yourself the most important member of the group.

Frex, my first 4e character was a human paladin. He did pitiful damage in combat (1d8+6) and had a low to-hit but he also happened to be the party skill monkey. I was the de-facto face man out of combat and spent most of my time in combat soaking up the damage while the other party members killed things off.

DS

 

[eriktheguy]

I understand that you want all-around stats, but that is a pretty bad stat allotment imo. You should probably try for at least one 18 if your race boosts your main stats.

 

[Garthanos]

I understand that you want all-around stats, but that is a pretty bad stat allotment imo. You should probably try for at least one 18 if your race boosts your main stats.

I have a fortunate circumstance in some regards all my players design characters like this... nearly as broad all around stats as possible... their competence as heroes gets compared to each other ;-) so its not a problem
I have to be careful to design char's similarly. Somebody with an 8 in a stat and a 20 in another is seen as an impaired caricature... humongous muscled idiot..

 

[DracoSuave]

Don't listen to them. Stat allotment is just fine. They can't do the basic math.

16 vs 18 is -1 to hit, -1 damage.

2d6 vs 1d8 is considerably less damage.

Want damage? Grab a weapon, beat face. Get powers that encourage weapons to faces.

Really, it is as simple as that. You're not doing damage because you have no damaging powers or feats.

Swap out Avenger Multi for 'WP: Good Stuff' and the other feat for 'Weapon Expertise: Good Stuff' to make up for the lower attack roll. When you get a weapon that can be used as a holy symbol (needed for a balanced build) take Weapon Focus: Good Stuff, and swap Weapon X for Focused Expertise: Good Stuff.

-THEN- take the Avenger Multiclasses. -After- you have something to do in Melee.

 

[Elric]

Don't listen to them. Stat allotment is just fine. They can't do the basic math.

Or perhaps people giving the advice on stats can do basic math but simply have a different assessment of the situation?

In particular, as people have mentioned, starting with Str 14, Con 13, Dex 14, Int 10, Wis 14, Cha 12 could be easily changed to Str 16, Int 8, Cha 10 for a stronger melee character at little cost.