New Design: Wizards...

[Lonely Tylenol]

A little more concealable? How big do you think the Tomes are, exactly? They don't have to be as big as an unabridged dictionary...any more than a standard spellbook does.

Yeah, but the wizard will look much cooler if he's got a book the size of a card table strapped to his back, especially if it periodically tries to escape.

 

[Snapdragyn]

Why virgins? The pure of heart and all that generally don't sin, and thus their souls go to heaven. What you want is to sacrifice someone bad, so that the evil entity gets that soul for themselves. Otherwise that soul could've went under someone else's purview.

Um, that's exactly why - they're getting something via the sacrifice which they would not otherwise have gotten. The evil soul was theirs already.

If I offer to give you your own car, would you prefer that to someone offering to give you a new car?

 

[gothmaugCC]

Actually, yes, yes it is in the Fellowship of the Ring. Book 2, Chapter 5; The Bridge of Khazad-Dum.

I stand corrected. I bow to your superior knowledge.

*races home to check his copy*

 

[F4NBOY]

Except that line isnt a classic (as it never appeared in the book). It was cobbled together from information from the Simmirilion for the movie.

HERESY!!!!

 

[Rechan]

No, but if the sorcerer class had, lets say 3 talent trees, and the dragonblood one was called "Veins of mighty might", which is a special family tree enjoyed by those who are proficient in fire magic, then yes i would feel hamstrung, as any fire based sorcer i created would by default be assumed to be decended from a dragon and belong to this family, as opposed to perhaps a demon.

Except you can't just slap "Demonblood" and then the Family is just the family of demons?

I still don't get it. There's nothing in that description that doesn't let you swap one word out for the next. Because the fluff text of the Sorcerer says: Blood of dragons.

There is a BIG difference between fluff text given in the flavor entry of the class, and fluff text intregrated into the mechanics of the class itself. Flufff intregrated directly into the class limits your possibilities. This is not a big deal in home games where everyone retools the rules to thier liking, but in a tournament style game (like the RPGA or Arcanis) where you have to follow the rules verbatim, your choices are limited right out of the starting gate.

That's what this is about?! Con games and official tournaments?

Tournaments and con games require specific settings anyways, so you're going to get hamstrung by the setting. So if the setting says "All wizards have blue hair" then you're going to have to have blue hair. If the rules doesnt' say you can learn magic from a demon, or your sorcerer can be demonblooded, then you can't, so this fuss is for nothing.

 

[Rechan]

Um, that's exactly why - they're getting something via the sacrifice which they would not otherwise have gotten. The evil soul was theirs already.

But if it's a Good soul then they usually can't touch it. Pure good is anathema to evil, after all. It's why evil can't touch a Good sword. A Soul that is Pure has got to be one hell of a pain to look at, much less touch.

f I offer to give you your own car, would you prefer that to someone offering to give you a new car?

Way I see it, it's not like you giving me my car. I see the Demons and such as Used Car Salesmen. Crazy Larry's Used Cars doesn't want Bob's Cheap Rides to get that old Miata; he wants the old Miata. But neither are guaranteed that Miata. That 2006 Mercedes? That's likely going to get sold back to the Mercedes dealership, and Larry and Bob's clientel likely won't be able to afford that 2006 Mercedes.

In the same vein, Orcus isn't guaranteed that evil soul any more then Beelzebub is. If that murderer dies, he likely goes to Murderer's Hell, not Beelzebub's realm or Orcus's. So if you offer that evil soul to them rather than where it would be going, it's one more soul for them to play with. But that virgin's soul? That's nuclear waste; they can't touch it.

 

[sidonunspa]

So do you feel hamstrung that the Sorcerer class's fluff text says: "Blood of dragons"? Does that prevent you from having a feyblooded Sorcerer, one trained by a demon, or in the wrong place at the wrong time when an artifact blew up?

I am certain that if your campaign world doesn't have Dragons, you can find another source for sorcerers.

True, but the Sorcerer still used generic schools on magic, all I had to do is change one line and I was done..

Now if a school of magic was called "Dragon Blooded" and the spells where names like "Dragon Breath" and "Claws of the Wyrm" it becomes a bit more complicated.

See if you have basic school names like Frost, Force, Thunder, enchantment, and Flame and connected them to fluff traditions of X, Y, Z then you have given me the tools to create what I want by disgarding X,Y,Z, and keeping the rules as they are.

Hell I can go so far as to say there are no traditions, but there are still schools of magic.

 

[Stone Dog]

Except that line isnt a classic (as it never appeared in the book). It was cobbled together from information from the Simmirilion for the movie.

so you need to say, "even Movies based on a classic" sound like anime.

Just being a pain in the arse

From wikipedia the book says "I am a servant of the Secret Fire, wielder of the flame of Anor. You cannot pass. The dark fire will not avail you, flame of Udûn. Go back to the Shadow! You cannot pass. " and the movie says "I am a servant of the secret fire, wielder of the Flame of Anor! Dark fire will not avail you, Flame of Udûn! Go back to the Shadow! YOU... SHALL NOT... PASS!!! " And the quote is in at least the BBC broadcast and a few other options. It at least existed before the movie, but since my copies aren't available I can't confirm whether it was in the book directly or not.

Just being a (very very scooped ) pain in the arse.

 

[JVisgaitis]

OK. That's twice the weird in one day. I never expected to see this stuff for Wizards which I think was a nice surprise in the first place. To see them gank out the Tome is double the weird, but I don't mind. I'm happy with staff, wand, and orb. The names are kinda eh, but like Ari said, you can easily swap those out for whatever you want.

 

[sidonunspa]

I stand corrected. I bow to your superior knowledge.

*races home to check his copy*

Ha!! next time do not question the stat monkey!!!

that will learn ya