New Haste - Does it Fix Your Concerns?

[Utrecht]

Many spells function as a replacement for feats or class abilities. Divine favor is better than Weapon Focus and (at 6+) better than Weapon Specialization. MotW's regenerate * wounds are a replacement for the epic Fast Healing. Feather fall replaces the monk's slow fall, etc. Even standbys like Spring Attack are easy enough with polymorph.

I'm not arguing that this is a good thing, just that it's not enough to change a spell.

I will certainly grant you the Divine Favor,

but the Regenerate X don't mimic the Fast Healing - since you have to cast the Spell BEFORE taking damage (so it is at best a lame version of the feat)

The Monk special ability is not a feat - so I really do not see the comparison.

And forgive my ignorance, but how could you use Polymorph to get Spring Attack??? To my knowledge you do not pick up the feats of the creature you turn into - only the Exceptional Abilities (which is where you could get the fast healing)

 

[Khorod]

the main page news today covers some revised 3E changes

 

[Shard O'Glase]

now having read the news, not only is the fix lame, but the reason is lame as well. Because it made quicken spell undesirable.

Um no quicken spell is undesirable because of the 4 spell levels. I wont take such a lame feat unless I have some serious flavor reasons for it.(or I supose if I go to epic levels) Haste never had anything to do with it, if quicken was even moderately effective people would take it on top of haste.

Haste better be 2nd level now, the big benefit for the fighter types when I cast it on themwas they could close and still get the full attack off, the extra attack and +4 to AC was just gravy. Now it just has lower level utility before full attacks become a big issue. Add in that it now does jack for the spellcasters and its just a really weak 3rd level spell.

 

[MerricB]

The funny thing is that this new version of haste is closer to the original, which didn't make spellcasting faster!

I think the change is a great improvement.

Cheers!

 

[Kaji]

Maybe a better solution might be something like Haste changed as proposed and then a higher level spell (6th, maybe?) called Greater Haste that pretty much does the same thing but adds the ability for spell casters to cast that second spell. And then also maybe reduce Quicken Spell from a 4 slots higher to only 3 slots higher feat. That would work for me. Hell, maybe I'll just HR it that way

 

[I'm A Banana]

I'm having problems reconciling the internal logic...

Right now, swinging a sword and casting a spell take the same amount of time.

So, HASTE makes you faster...

Fast enough to make another sword swing, but not cast a spell.

Eh?

Seriously...they shoulda just dropped the +4 AC, either to a +2, or nothing. It makes some sense because the speed isn't instantly controlable -- you don't enter bullet time, per se, you just start moving really fast, which is harder to control, making you unable to gain much a defensive benefit from it.

Maybe I'm just disgruntled.

It doesn't actually change that much, I guess...which is more depressing than cool.

These seem to be a mixed bag right now...which is scary....but I guess I can add or subtract as I see fit.

 

[shilsen]

I think it's fine as a rule change. I can't see any medium or high-level spellcaster being handicapped in comparison to other classes due to this change, and I do think it makes Quicken Spell more viable.

 

[MerricB]

I'm having problems reconciling the internal logic...

Right now, swinging a sword and casting a spell take the same amount of time.

So, HASTE makes you faster...

Fast enough to make another sword swing, but not cast a spell.

Think of it this way:

Haste allows you to act faster, such as swinging a sword blade, or opening a tap.

But the water flowing from that tap (magic) remains at the same speed. Thus magic can't be cast any faster because you have to rely on its internal rules rather than the rules of how fast your body is moving.

Cheers!

 

[Ace]

I have no problem with the way Haste is....I have no need to change it in my game.

I am not changing it either

 

[d12]

I suspect that I will house rule the new haste to allow an extra attack, move or spell - perhaps dropping the AC bonus. I think its fun to cast two spells in a round and if the badguys can do it too then its okay.