New modules with 1E feel??

[der_kluge]

What an interesting argument.

I've never really thought about a module in terms of plot before.

I mean, Jester47 points out, people buy modules that are *devoid* of plot because they like the ready to use dungeon.

At first, I thought this was crazy, and was about to accuse Jester47 of smoking crack, but then I thought about it - I have two modules that I have wrapped my entire campaign around - Black Ice Well, and Hellstone Deep - two MonkeyGod modules. I used another module - Treasures of Elbard (also from MG) that I really, really tore to bits, and used only for some names, and an location idea. These two core modules are sparse on plot, and I have more or less ignored all of the plot elements that they contain, or have at least modified large chunks of some of the significant plot, while still drawing inspiration from them.

Given that, I believe my fundamental belief about modules may be completely wrong. It seems to me, now, that modules that are just skeletons of nothing but a location are what people are really looking for.

Excuse me while I join a cult and re-examine my fundamental beliefs of the universe.

 

[D+1]

WoTC doesn't make very many modules because there's no money in it. It's a big reason why they created the d20 license. Because they decided to allow d20 publishers to create all those modules for them.

Turns out, most d20 publishers figured out that there isn't any money to be made in modules either, so now most of them put out sourcebooks.

What is a sourcebook except a guide to use for writing your own adventures?

I see three circumstances in which a module will be successful.

1. The module presents places and events that do not seem to exist for the purpose of DRIVING the PC's through them to a conclusion. It can be merged with ongoing events from a wide variety of campaigns without unduly affecting either one.
2. The module is SO well-written that DM's will BEND their campaigns as much as they will adapt the module trying to make the two fit together.
3. The module is geared specifically (or by dumb luck fits perfectly anyway) for the campaign setting and events you ARE running - which is damned unlikely.

That's a tough job. Even if you do everything right - just enough plot to keep the module together but no so much that it's anything but a breeze to adapt; it's nonetheless NOT filled with statblocks but with descriptions of people, places and events that will constitute the adventure with the PC's; it doesn't rely on rules, places, or events that are specific to a given setting - you still aren't going to sell it to someone who doesn't need or want the particular murder mystery, kidnap & ransom, save-the-world or scavenger hunt you've concocted. Even if they DO want or need it they have to FIND it by sifting the wheat from the chaff that's out there and when it's all said and done they've expended as much effort as simply making it up themselves.

In the heyday of 1E the game was not being driven by modules on the shelves - it was being driven by the imaginations of the participants themselves. When a new module came out it wasn't a continuation of a storyline from the same setting that everyone was playing - it was a welcome break from otherwise having to invent this weeks game from whole cloth. The fact that there were a few cool people, places, events, and widgets in there was a SPARK to the imagination, not a crutch.

I'm really a big believer in this notion. People just don't realize that their nostalgia for 1E derives less from the official product than what they themselves then did with what they had available. Yes, I remember fondly the giants/underdark/drow series, the slavers modules, temple of elemental evil, etc. I remember MORE fondly the assassinations of the Emperor of Lankhmar, the PC kidnappings and murders by the Red Brigade, the evil betrayal by Bored Flak, the Intercontinental Magic Missile Silo, THE lich, the OTHER lich, Grond the Antipaladin, Zichnoid the anticleric and his undead army, Fort Blood, Ogrehelm, the evil PC brothers Feric and Remmler Jeager, the recurring NPC Alfredo Garcia, the fight to kill Tiamat, the fight to destroy the egg being hatched to replace her (and the subsequent eternal enslavement of Durnwe, a dwarf PC, by Asmodeus before the party retreated), exploring The Portals, Durnwe's Folly (aka Nomelin's bracers), Misty Boots of Silent Speed and the Hasted Mithral Plate of Amazing Agility, The Castle Timeless, Ghallanger heavy crossbows and the doubly-deadly Scarlet Angel Express, and week after week after WEEK of other adventures. THAT is the 1E "feel". The GDQ series and Gygax's writing style in the DMG helped, but weren't the defining characteristics of 1E - they were simply common elements in the MUCH larger, but very individual pictures everyone was looking at.

 

[Nightfall]

Jez,

That's a very cogent arguement. One I also agree with. Btw another reason to like NG's mods. They use Orcus as a god and you can still fight him.

 

[Matafuego]

jester47 that was... gold...

 

[Nightfall]

Indeed it was Mata. I suggest Jez you copy and paste that and keep it around. Someone might want to see that again.

 

[Treebore]

BTW, Clark, of Necromancer games, or maybe it was Bill, posted a couple of days ago on their messageboards that they made a whopping $4.00/hour off of their modules last year. That is why they still work as a lawyer or teacher, I forget who does which for a living.

 

[Melan]

I think Bill is in biochem. No matter, they indeed do this as a hobby. I predict that we will see more and more of this attitude, especially if the market contracts due to no new entrants.

 

[Grazzt]

From an old interview with Clark Peterson regarding First Edition Feel (and Necromancer Games):

Clark: First Edition is the cover of the old DMG with the City of Brass; it is Judges Guild; it is Type IV demons not Tanaari and Baatezu; it is the Vault of the Drow not Drizzt Do'urden; it is the Tomb of Horrors not the Ruins of Myth Drannor; it is orcs not ogrillons; it is mind flayers not Ilithids (or however they spell it); it is Tolkien, Moorcock, Howard and Lieber, not Eddings, Hickman, Jordan and Salavatore; it is definitely Orcus and the demon-princes and not the Blood War; it is Mordenkainen's Faithful Hound not Elminster's Evasion; and it is Artifacts and Relics from the old DMG (with all the cool descriptions).

I always say we want to be the VW Bug of roleplaying companies, meaning that we want to have a modern style and appeal but an obvious link to the past. One of the ways we do that is how we design the modules. For example, we use full color covers (not that funky mono-color of the old modules). But our modules have the same basic format of the old modules—inset art, module number in the upper left corner, diagonal band in the upper left corner, logo placement, etc. I guarantee you, when you look at one of our modules you will flash back to the old ones—just like when you see a new VW bug. And hopefully you will say "Man, that is just like an old module except cooler."

 

[Melan]

I became a fan when I read that interview. This was back in 2000... Man, 3.5 years, 3.5e... Has it really been that long?

 

[jester47]

BTW, Clark, of Necromancer games, or maybe it was Bill, posted a couple of days ago on their messageboards that they made a whopping $4.00/hour off of their modules last year. That is why they still work as a lawyer or teacher, I forget who does which for a living.

True True. But considering how much time Clark and Bill put in, thats gotta be guite a sum!! In the thousands I would guess. And I assume that is after costs of production are covered. So writers and artists have been paid. Profitable for a hobby business, yes. Hugely insanely pleases the borad of directors profitable? Probably (definately) not. Modules can make money. They just don't make "MONEY!" But thats just hobby gaming in general. As the old saying goes: The fastest way to make a small fortune in gaming is to start with a large one. So any form of financial success indicates that you are going somthing right. And I would suspect that early TSR considered any cash beyond expense good cash. WotC does not have the same philosophy.

I still think a book of 32 generic 1e style dungeon layouts would fly off the shelves. But that is just my opinion. I should try it out someday.

Aaron.