New screenshots of character visualizer, virtual tabletop

[Zinovia]

Perhaps by the time they get it right, they'll have Mac support and character icons for every MM entry.

Hahahahaha...err... yeah. Mac support? Minis you don't have to pay for? Want a pony with that?

I think that the graphics look outdated and ugly. The women they have shown look excessively masculine. I'm an amateur 3D artist (more experience in 2D and graphic design), but I can still make better art than that on my own. What I'd like to see is for the character generator to be compatible with some of the standard 3D file formats so that you can import a 3D model. That's unlikely to happen, given the difficulty of fitting weapons and armor onto a non-standard model. Fair enough.

What the character generator seems to be for (graphically speaking) is producing a 2D image using 3D modeling. I imagine it goes something like this: You dress the character with the right items and accessories, rotate and pose them the way you want, then you can print off your portrait for the character sheet, or a 2D image with a backdrop that you select. So you don't need a machine capable of animating these figures. That takes a lot more horsepower than just rotating them and moving their limbs into different poses. It can take the time to re-render each step, without worrying about realtime lag. Have it drop to flat-shaded models while rotating or posing, then re-render when you stop fiddling with it.

The state of 3D modeling is very advanced nowadays. We should be able to get images that look much better than the ones we've seen, given that the model is just being rendered to 2D anyway. Here's a nice look at what the amateur 3D artists like myself have to work with DAZ3D human models. These models are cheap, versatile, have endless morphs available to make them look different (including things to make them look like aliens, elves, whatever). I know that purchasing 3D models for use in a company product isn't the same as me buying one for individual use, but come on! The tech is there, the work has been done. Why reinvent the (ugly) wheel? Gah. But I have a Mac, so I'll be making my *own* character portraits using my 3D rendering toys.

None of this applies by the way to the VTT. That is supposed to look like minis on a tabletop, so it's slightly different. Still kind of crude, but I'm not commenting on the modeling for that. *shrug*

 

[malladin]

Even though someone else said it 'bringing us the best graphic technology 1999 has offer' is the best and funiest description of this I've seen so far.

 

[Zinovia]

Even though someone else said it 'bringing us the best graphic technology 1999 has offer' is the best and funiest description of this I've seen so far.

Lol, that's priceless.

 

[Voss]

'99 had better graphics than that.

But on the graphics... its interesting look at the thing. Personally, I don't care about the system at all, and don't want it. And sure, it might be fine for a small portion of the audience that doesn't care about the graphics. But...

this is theoretically a professional product that they want to sell to people. Including new people, and people who are used to a certain graphical standard in computer products. Being a year or two behind the curve is acceptable to a general audience. A full decade behind? That will damage sales severely and drive off people that would otherwise buy it. This looks like a poorly implemented and poorly funded attempt at a shoddy virtual tabletop. It also gives the impression that TPTB don't take it seriously, and it will be dropped 6 months to a year after release.

Which works for me, because then they can put more money into the game and not the silly side projects.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

Even though someone else said it 'bringing us the best graphic technology 1999 has offer' is the best and funiest description of this I've seen so far.

Seriously, it's truly amazing how awful those player models are. I mean, I'm really pressed to think of anything that looks worse than the hideous man-lady and the "Igor"-esque fighter or cleric or whatever the hell he is. How can anyone possibly not think those faces and bodies look terrible? Embarassing, even.

I mean, I'd rather have non-animated 2D characters in the applications than those horrid things.

Zinovia - You say "why invent the (ugly) wheel", and you're spot on. It's bizzzzzzzzzzzzzare. So many easily available attractive 3D models, so many talented 3D modellers out there, and DDI somehow manages to hire the one who makes every face look like a horses' rear end. I mean, jeez, you can spare a few more polys for the face, guys, you can even use LOD on it if that upsets you!

 

[Silvergriffon]

Really, the tabletop looks OK to me but I have to say again that those characer creator models are soooooo bad! The biggest problem with this is that people will see screenshots like that and will dismiss the whole product as being an amateurish piece of junk without ever taking a closer look at the product as a whole. So, no matter how good the rest of it is, this could adversely affect sales.

 

[SteveC]

Really, the tabletop looks OK to me but I have to say again that those characer creator models are soooooo bad! The biggest problem with this is that people will see screenshots like that and will dismiss the whole product as being an amateurish piece of junk without ever taking a closer look at the product as a whole. So, no matter how good the rest of it is, this could adversely affect sales.

I think this is an important point. While I wasn't planning on using this system, I was hoping it would be good and thought I might get into it later on ... I have some friends who are a fair bit away from me, so why not give it a try?

And then I see this terrible graphics. Just horrible. Unless I see things have seriously improved, I'm out of this. I am working on a gaming project at the moment, and when considering artwork, I had a number of industry professionals tell me "no art is better than bad art." This is bad art, and I suggest that WotC get rid of it entirely until they can get something decent up.

--Steve

 

[Belorin]

They have screenshots for class and items, but not for race. I wonder...


Bel

 

[Aeolius]

Here's a nice look at what the amateur 3D artists like myself have to work with...

I've been messing with Poser since version 2 and Bryce since KPT Bryce. Here's a quick render I did years ago, to show someone what could be done in under 5 minutes. Bryce + Poser

 

[fnwc]

Now, having said that, the virtual tabletop does have a hill to climb before I'm willing to buy in. It has to offer something to beat Fantasy Grounds. Fantasy grounds has worked great for me. I've already payed for it. I won't have to keep paying every month. Now what would beat FG for my purposes? Don't know at this point. Wizards has to sell me on that.

I think we all agree the graphics are poor; while this is not a deal breaker for me, I would prefer something that looks polished. That being said, the biggest selling point for me is how well the rule set is automatically integrated into electronic tools that will enhance/quicken my gaming experience. I've used just about all of the possible electronic RPG tools out there, Fantasy Grounds, eTools, etc. I've compiled a wishlist of things I think would really justify the subscription cost of DDI.

Things I would like to see:

1. Character generator/sheet - This has to support all of their official rulebooks, and will work at least as good as eTools or other similar programs. Should be able to autocalculate any calculated values on the sheet, and auto-populate values that are appropriate (e.g., spells). They should also give the option to use a non-calculating/validating character sheet (for custom stuff)
2. Character Validator - Can validate a character sheet meeting some 'requirement' so that a DM doesn't have to thoroughly evaluate a character to see if they are 'legal' (i.e., to prevent a level 2 warrior from having a Warhammer +5)
3. Power/spell cards - Included in the character sheet, should auto-generate a printable page of your powers for easy reference
4. Automatic encounter generators for DM (should populate in to the combat tracker tool)
5. Combat Tracker to track initiative, hp, effects, etc. Should autopopulate values from the MM (if you own it). Figures should be tied to this as well, so you can easily add figures to the map. You should be allowed to save the Combat Tracker states so that an enterprising DM can pre-populate the tracker for various fights in a module, to save time at the table.
6. It would be nice to be able to see the various combat effects on the map per unit; this could be represented by small graphics hovering above the figure. An example might be a green droplet indicating a unit is poisoned, a cloud with 'zzzz' indicating a unit is unconscious/sleeping.
7. Easy access to all of your hardback books; all content should be indexed and searchable. There should be an easy way to 'reference' this material, perhaps by dragging the header of a body of text into the chat window, so you can share it with all of the other players, or the DM, in case a rules question comes up. This would also come in handy while building a character, especially if you can search for something like All Feats that contain the words 'attack of opportunity'.
8. All of the subsystems should integrate well with each other. For example, opening the Combat Tracker and dragging the 'figure' icon onto the map could allow you to automatically grab the needed figure from your virtual collection. This would save the time of having to search through your miniatures to add it. I'd like to be able to drag a monster heading from the MM into the Combat Tracker and have it populate the appropriate values.
9. A party treasure sheet that shows different information for the PCs and for the DM. PCs would be able to see things like 'long sword' and 'amber gem'. The DM would see the same items as a long sword +1 and 50 gp amber gem. It would be nice to toggle whether or not the PCs had detected a magical aura on the item -- things like that. It would be even nicer if the sheet could be tied to the PCs character inventories easily.
10. Some of the examples of integration mentioned above really fall into a thing that might be called 'context sensitive dragging'. Dragging the entry of a long sword +2, Defender from the PHB to a character sheet would equip that character with that weapon and add it to their inventory. Doing the same thing onto a Combat Tracker entry would equip the appropriate monster with it, or add it to its treasure (depending on where it's dropped). Dragging and dropping it into the chat window would give the text entry from the PHB in OOC chat. Dragging and dropping it onto the map would put a sword figure on the ground representing it.
11. The ability to save the state of the entire adventure, from the placement of the figures on the map, to the Combat Tracker, etc.

There are plenty of other things I can't think of right now, but implementing stuff like this would be a big selling point (for me).